KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum Lucas - Normal Service Resumed

FFS!!!!!!! I'm not singling him out for this one game. Read my posts and you will see I am saying he is just not good enough and needs replacing. What's so bad about playing Meireles and Gerrard in midfield. Surely you have to agree that is a better option. I have always had the same opinion of Lucas and a few decent games isn't going to change that. Yes there were a lot of bad players, Gerrard included, but how many times has Gerrard pulled us out of the fire? Lucas doesn't have the ability to do anything remotely close to that. A central midfielder should be able to set the game on fire and Lucas just can't do that. Again, it's not just this game that I am talking about. If you think that we don't need to replace him in midfield either with a new player or a young guy coming through then you must be happy with mid table, cause that's all we will acheive with him pulling the strings.

Reclaim: I actually agree with some of the things You say in that post, but then as usual You sum it up with that drivel 'bout everything per definition was better back in the old days! Even the fans were better!

You sound like a broken old 78 record!

May it have been easier being 'fair and loyal' in the 80's just because we were the best team to be found then? Easier to cope with some occasional draws or even losses when You're still at the top of the table/world!

After more than 20 years in the twilight zone, even the most educated and well behaved fan may want to finally start seeing some progress and results. What we don't want then is a manager who 100% of the time totally misinterprets any situation on and off the pitch - and who generally believe we're just gonna swallow his malarkey without a blink.

Your views are based on what your reading here?
But we didnt have the internet back then so you cant make that judgement.

I keep going back to the good old days as you say for the simple reason the Club was a different Club than the one we see today. You mention that it's because we were the top club in those days, well the fans were fair and supportive back in the 60's when we were nothin, even when we were in the second division the fans stuck by players and managers because fans knew they needed to support the team more when things are going badly than when things are going well for you. You are having a go at the manager saying he does'nt understand yet it is clear for all to see he is slowly turning things around and we are getting better as the season goes along, we are six unbeaten and are 9th in the league a win and some results and we could be fifth. I simply despair at some fans having a go at the manager when he is now doing well, we are not out of the woods yet but given time we could have a decent season, getting on Lucas back and bad mouthing our manager is not the way forward.

IN ROY WE TRUST...

People where educated in the 60s. 70s, 80s and even in the 90. We knew sounsess wasn't good enough to be manager, Evans was a good manager to soft hence why houllier came in, after 5years with him we knew he wernt the man for the job.

It's only been since rafa that the fans are split with, there the fans who thought he was the manager for the job and those who wanted rid

Now Roy is in charge. I'd say there's a majority of educated fans who don't think he's the man for the job, and theres a minority of fans who want to give him time. Supporters are split again

To say there's supporters who arnt as educated as those in the past is wrong, it's just difference of opinions, and certain people can't hack it that we don't all agree. Deal with it, football is about opinions wether it's if you rate a player or rate the manager

Just an add on to that post

The majority of supporters don't want him as manager, therefore their the educated, the ones who don't aren't.

Aah, okay so now those of us who are not on the "I love Roy" bandwagon are "unfair and shabby"? We're not "educated and loyal", are we?

Maybe we should look at that word 'loyal'. If my boss employs a new section manager above me, I should immediately be loyal to the new man, right? Wrong! That's not called being loyal - that's known as 'naive'. People of the last few decades are 'educated' enough to understand the difference; blind loyalty is no longer a desirable character trait in anyone, but you expect it in football supporters for some reason.

So this new manager I now have does not have my loyalty. But let's say my company does (we're going to assume that I like the company's commercial direction and the boss is a good man who makes good decisions etc, and I have this loyalty based on my own experience). What do I do? I must listen to the new manager's instructions (he's still my superior) and if he treats me well and his decision making is proven to be good over time (not just the odd flash in the pan) then he will earn my loyalty and respect as a natural progression.

But if he makes poor decisions that lead to projects missing deadlines or being canned by the customer, and then blames his underlings (who include me) rather than taking responsibility for his actions, then he will not gain my loyalty until he makes amends or gets fired. I think most people behave in this fashion. Being loyal to a man who essentially spits in your face, tells the world you are useless, and generally can't find his way to making a decent decision is pretty damn stupid, I think you'll agree.

Now maybe Roy is not that bad, but he's got an awful lot to make up for in the loyalty department. I did not start out disliking him; I figured he was not a match for LFC before he was appointed, but I supported him until it was pretty obvious he was going wrong (being in the relegation zone after 8 games with a squad of full internationals is a pretty strong indication that he was going wrong). I don't hear the Wigan manager complaining about squad depth or not having "anything to work with". He had a chance to address these issues in the transfer window, but he mostly bought players who would not address the obvious issues instead.

I'm warming to Lucas because, as LFC1984 has said, he came to the club as a 19 year old and has improved tremendously over the past two seasons. He can be expected to need a lot of time because he is young. Roy on the other hand is 63 with 35 years of experience managing footballers; he shouldn't need 2-3 seasons to show he's capable! He asked for 10 premiership games to show how good he was, and after 10 games we were 12th in the premiership after our worst start in 57 years: in other words under his tenure we played the worst football this club has played during his lifetime.

We're still loyal to LFC; none of us are leaving just because the previous owners hired the wrong guy. But please explain to me why we should be 'loyal' to this man.

It's 'they never would have treated...'
NOT 'they never would OF treated...'

But I'm not well educated either..

To be honest, am not a Lucas fan, I don't rate him at all, but the he did play well for the few games before the Wigan game, and has been showing progress.

This topic is harsh, over the last 6 games Lucas has had one bad game, lets see how he gets on against Stoke and West ham before jumping on that band wagon again.

It's not a band wagon - it's a huge Air Craft Carrier! US style!