KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum Time To be Realistic

but we get embarrassed in the champions league just the same this is my point, we were embarrassed by that Bulgarian team and also Basel so that answers your question. You can answer one for me now...Arsenal Football Club has played in the Champions league for the last 12 seasons consecutively since they last won the League, exactly how has it benefited them in terms of winning a major trophy in this time. What would you rather do for the next ten season, appear in the champions league like Celtic, P.S.V and Olympikos do and get bounced out before the knock out stage or against the first good team we play or win a domestic cup, put it in the trophy cabinet, have somethin to show for your seasons efforts and have a great day out winning it. We are no longer the Liverpool Football Club from 30 years ago same as Leeds, Villa and Everton who all go back years to there glory days, football has changed and it won't go back to those times and this is what people need to accept and stop banging on about fanbases or previous trophies won a quarter of a century ago...

We got knocked out because we lost our best player, didn't replace him and had a manager that had never managed at the top level before.

As for what Arsenal have got out of it? You must be fukking kidding? How about their stadium for one and the money to buld it? What about the 2 FA cups the last couple of years? How about being able to attract top quality players like Ozil, Sanchez and to be able to keep their good players in the main?

I really don't get where you're coming from. You seem to want us to be the next Villa or Leeds. Just getting by and winning the odd cup. That's not for me I'm afraid. We may never get back to what we were as the footballing landscape has changed and we don't have the money to compete with City and Chelsea and Utd. But what's the point in giving up?

Great response and there is no need for me to add anything as this is exactly what I would have wrote.

you still haven't answered my point so I will ask again...how have Arsenal benefited from playing in the Champions League in what the whole aim of sport is in being successful on the pitch and winning. All you have done is mention a stadium, yes very nice but all the stadium, Sanchez and Ozil of this world have only returned two F..A Cups in that time and that's hardly a good return for playing 12 consecutive seasons, if I remember rite they even got beat by Birmingham City in the League Cup Final and Birmingham got relegated that season too. If you look at Arsenal there main success was built on the back of cheaper players in fact like Veira, Petite, Toure and home grown and players already there like Adams and Bould e.t.c nothing to do with champions League...

That stadium and financial structure has enabled Arsenal to retain their place as one of England's biggest clubs. It has allowed them to compete in Europe, challenge for league titles and win cups. Not everyone can win everything all the time. Their stadium was essential to keep them where they are and slowly but surely become more & powerful, whilst more teams became richer and richer and more of a threat.

A more important question, is "where would they be without the stadium"?

You do know that Sanchez and Ozil have only been there for a couple of seasons and not 12?

Signing those two world class players were a result of being in the Champions League on a regular basis. They wouldn't have had the pull or financial capability for these players without regular Champions League involvement. Both Sanchez and Ozil were regular starters at Barcelona and Real Madrid respectively, can you honestly see Liverpool signing players like that?

Arsenal also have a very realistic shot at the Premiership this season so they are absolutely miles ahead of LFC in terms of stadium, financials and the playing squad.

It's been a good return considering over that time Chelsea and more recently City, have spent a countries national debt building teams whilst Arsenal for many years had to balance the books. Every statistic out there in the modern game and specifically the EPL equates winning with expenditure. However, Wenger keeping them in the champions' league has meant he has been able to build a team slowly and still attract players when and as the books improved to the stage now where they have 100's of millions sat there if required with a manager who is as tight as they come but still has a team bordering on great.

The fact remains they are now in a very solid position some of which has come from the CL money and it's allure.

I don't know how many times I have to ask the question, all I am getting is stuff about solid team, great stadium nice expensive players to look at e.t.c the question is what have they actually won besides two F.A Cups hardly a great return and only one more trophy than Swansea, Birmingham, Midflesborough, Wigan and Portsmouth, the only way you can gage how much benefit it is, is by looking at what you have actually won, stadiums, players and solid bases are not much good when you end each season empty handed like what Arsenal have done in the last 12 years apart from 2 Seasons...

Again, you are kidding right?? Arsenal are in a brilliant position BECAUSE they have been in the ECL for 12 seasons. Look where we are after not being in it for just a few seasons. Can you tell me you wouldn't swap what they have for what we have? And do you expect them to be winning the league for every one of those 12 seasons to make it a 'success'?

And the stadium, aren't you one of the people who have moaned the most about us NOT getting a new stadium? Again, what do you want? We could've had a new stadium (maybe) had we been a constant in the ECL.

All the stuff I seem to remember you moaning about us NOT having!