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NoMark One
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NoMark One
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But your whole argument on us being a smaller club is based on recent successes! So you're either choosing to under-exaggerate our own, over-exaggerate theirs, or just pick and choose when you apply it. A stadium doesn't win a title. Players do, and right now, Arsenal have continued to be off the pace for more than 5 years, in a period where we have actually finished runners-up. You can't just pick and choose when to apply the principle. It undermines all the points you're making.
I think that the top 7 clubs are big clubs. Your comments suggest otherwise - in that finishing runners-up is not good enough. Which Arsenal are the same as us. I am saying you are being hypocritical by suggesting that because there are mitigating circumstances elsewhere meaning they can't be as competitive as they could be right now, but when it comes to us, you're choosing to over-look it. It's a point which you've made two stances on. One for us, and one for them. you mentioned Arsenal and us being on an equal footing somehow and I disagree that's all, Although Arsenal and ourselves have had recent lack of success there are mitigating circumstances in Arsenals case as they have had to fund a new stadium, this is my point. I think Liverpool are a big club in name only, I think we are one of the most famous clubs in the world the same as Benfica and Ajax but we are no longer a big Club in anything else, I honestly don't count global fanbases as its far too fickle to judge the criteria, power and money is what makes a club big in my book and unfortunately we have neither, this is the point I am trying to make.
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 683
Under 18 Player
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Under 18 Player
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But your whole argument on us being a smaller club is based on recent successes! So you're either choosing to under-exaggerate our own, over-exaggerate theirs, or just pick and choose when you apply it. A stadium doesn't win a title. Players do, and right now, Arsenal have continued to be off the pace for more than 5 years, in a period where we have actually finished runners-up. You can't just pick and choose when to apply the principle. It undermines all the points you're making.
I think that the top 7 clubs are big clubs. Your comments suggest otherwise - in that finishing runners-up is not good enough. Which Arsenal are the same as us. I am saying you are being hypocritical by suggesting that because there are mitigating circumstances elsewhere meaning they can't be as competitive as they could be right now, but when it comes to us, you're choosing to over-look it. It's a point which you've made two stances on. One for us, and one for them. you mentioned Arsenal and us being on an equal footing somehow and I disagree that's all, Although Arsenal and ourselves have had recent lack of success there are mitigating circumstances in Arsenals case as they have had to fund a new stadium, this is my point. I think Liverpool are a big club in name only, I think we are one of the most famous clubs in the world the same as Benfica and Ajax but we are no longer a big Club in anything else, I honestly don't count global fanbases as its far too fickle to judge the criteria, power and money is what makes a club big in my book and unfortunately we have neither, this is the point I am trying to make. Fair point to, agree with the majority apart from the global fan base comment, only have to look at countries NorwaY, Sweden and Denmark where our fan base is huge and probably in those countries there's more LFC fans than Britain and Ireland combined and thats not an exaggerating, during our success in the 80's we became huge in those Scandanavian (excuse the spelling) countries and still are. New Zealand is another place where we have a collosal following my mate moved down there last April and said you see 3 or 4 LFC shirt for every 1 Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc shirt, again no exaggeration.
No,this is not a good town for psychedelic drugs.Reality itself is too twisted.
We can't stop here, this is bat country!
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NoMark One
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NoMark One
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If you're saying all big clubs are only those that win the premier league title, then you're right NoMark One.
But they're not. It would be wrong to clasify Arsenal as anything other than a big club. Given that we've arguably had better/equal success as them over the last 5 years - while they finish higher in the league, we've done much better in the cups, despite the stadium situation, proves we are as big a club as them. I don't care for this big club melodrama anymore. I actually dislike coming on here. Not because of alternate opinions, only that people can't even explain their reasoning on why the think the way they do.
That you think the club is not big, proves you really don't understand the club at all, or you're trying to set the benchmark way too high.
On you thoughts, only City, Chelsea and Man Utd could be seen as big clubs. Because no other team has won the league recently, or looked like it. you are not seriously comparing us to the best run club in the world are you, if you are you need to be fair and take things into consideration. Arsenal only won the League two seasons before us in Istanbul, they then won the F.A.Cup the next season, they moved into there new stadium in 2006 have paid it off and at the same time managed to play Champions League every season which is absolutely astonishing taking into account they have regularly sold there best players every season. What you have to remember is Arsenal were probably the best side in the country before they started paying for there stadium and now that it's paid for there is no reason it won't happen again, please don't compare us to Arsenal as its a joke, they have not won things recently but there have been mitigating circumstances for that. Good comments re: Arsenal. It amazes me how Arsenal fans are unhappy - many even want Wenger out!. These people are clueless beyond belief. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they won the league again within the next couple of years. I honestly think we will be seeing a totaly different Club in Arsenal now, they are signing Higuain and are poised to take Rooney from United so it looks already like the purse strings are off and there wage structure out the window, if those two are signed u can seriously seeing them go close with Higuain and Rooney up top supported by Podolski and Walcott and the Ox either side, they do need a keeper tho as that position has haunted them for years.
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Joined: Oct 2009
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Liverpool Legend
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Liverpool Legend
Joined: Oct 2009
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Aresnal are the next big team to break out. Ground paid for and talk f new owners and financing.
The top four are pulling away
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY
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NoMark One
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NoMark One
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But your whole argument on us being a smaller club is based on recent successes! So you're either choosing to under-exaggerate our own, over-exaggerate theirs, or just pick and choose when you apply it. A stadium doesn't win a title. Players do, and right now, Arsenal have continued to be off the pace for more than 5 years, in a period where we have actually finished runners-up. You can't just pick and choose when to apply the principle. It undermines all the points you're making.
I think that the top 7 clubs are big clubs. Your comments suggest otherwise - in that finishing runners-up is not good enough. Which Arsenal are the same as us. I am saying you are being hypocritical by suggesting that because there are mitigating circumstances elsewhere meaning they can't be as competitive as they could be right now, but when it comes to us, you're choosing to over-look it. It's a point which you've made two stances on. One for us, and one for them. you mentioned Arsenal and us being on an equal footing somehow and I disagree that's all, Although Arsenal and ourselves have had recent lack of success there are mitigating circumstances in Arsenals case as they have had to fund a new stadium, this is my point. I think Liverpool are a big club in name only, I think we are one of the most famous clubs in the world the same as Benfica and Ajax but we are no longer a big Club in anything else, I honestly don't count global fanbases as its far too fickle to judge the criteria, power and money is what makes a club big in my book and unfortunately we have neither, this is the point I am trying to make. Fair point to, agree with the majority apart from the global fan base comment, only have to look at countries NorwaY, Sweden and Denmark where our fan base is huge and probably in those countries there's more LFC fans than Britain and Ireland combined and thats not an exaggerating, during our success in the 80's we became huge in those Scandanavian (excuse the spelling) countries and still are. New Zealand is another place where we have a collosal following my mate moved down there last April and said you see 3 or 4 LFC shirt for every 1 Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc shirt, again no exaggeration. my own view on shirt sales in those countries is that it's not really a valid point to judge on, we are taking it for granted that those fans are like us in that we only buy the shirt of the club we support and that's not the case in those countries, we here would never dream of buying an Arsenal, City or Chelsea shirt when there new ones come out but over there in yhose places because the love English football so much they go out and buy them. Look at it this way Here in Liverpool fans buy the Liverpool or Everton shirt if they were to buy another shirt to play footie in or something they might buy the Barcalona or Madrid one, Real Madrid or Barca can't seriously include Billy from Anfield or John from Walton as fans of there Club just because they have bought there shirt now can they so it's not a valid yardstick for fanbases. If you are to include it those fans who buy English Premier League shirts will be included in Liverpool, United, Chelsea, City and Arsenals global fanbases as they have bought each one of there shirts when they have come out over the last 5 seasons.
Last edited by NoMark One; 21/06/13 12:20 PM.
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 683
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Under 18 Player
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Maybe so, but its based on opinion as you dont really know that to see it for yourself that said i cant say your wrong either but i do know in Ireland and Norway if you see a person with a Liverpool/United/Arsenal shirt on 80% of the time that person will support that club, i dont know about City or Chelsea though as i have a friend who never followed football all his life but last year bought a City shirt and went to a City game, he admitted he was a glory hunter but only went for the drinking "session" in Manchester with the boys, nothing wrong with that but kind of gives your point more weight.
No,this is not a good town for psychedelic drugs.Reality itself is too twisted.
We can't stop here, this is bat country!
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Joined: Mar 2011
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1st Team Squad
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1st Team Squad
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Aresnal are the next big team to break out. Ground paid for and talk f new owners and financing.
The top four are pulling away Yet some people remain convinced that we can finish above both arsenal & spurs when we can't even get past Everton. I'd love to hear the reasoning!
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Joined: Jun 2010
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Thier fans come across as a bunch of d1cks. The new stadium had to be paid for by reducing spend on players. It was necessary in order to secure the future of the club. Yet they have still managed to stay in the CL every year. Wenger has done an incredible job. Arsenal are a club in some respects we aspire to be and rightfully so. They are run very well and pure apathy amongst their fans as you say is flabbergasting. That said LFC have had an horrendous time since 2007, the high of reaching a 2nd Champs league final and having a brilliant team and manager has been destroyed for the most part. The recovery shoots are there but for people to say we are a spent force is vastly premature. In these troubled times(last 7yrs) our profile has been maintained by being in several finals.
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NoMark One
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NoMark One
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Aresnal are the next big team to break out. Ground paid for and talk f new owners and financing.
The top four are pulling away Stanlley this is my whole point, I said in an earlier post that over the next five years you are possibly looking at United being the weakest of the top four, that for me is absolutely frightening given United are the biggest Club in the World, top four are going into a whole new stratosphere than the rest of us am afraid.
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NoMark One
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NoMark One
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Thier fans come across as a bunch of d1cks. The new stadium had to be paid for by reducing spend on players. It was necessary in order to secure the future of the club. Yet they have still managed to stay in the CL every year. Wenger has done an incredible job. Arsenal are a club in some respects we aspire to be and rightfully so. They are run very well and pure apathy amongst their fans as you say is flabbergasting. That said LFC have had an horrendous time since 2007, the high of reaching a 2nd Champs league final and having a brilliant team and manager has been destroyed for the most part. The recovery shoots are there but for people to say we are a spent force is vastly premature. In these troubled times(last 7yrs) our profile has been maintained by being in several finals. the big, big thing which makes Liverpool different from all the other Clubs outside the big four is that they can all survive and get by on not playing Champions league whereas we are dead in the water if we don't get back in sharpish as our whole club and fanbase exists and runs on Champions league and proper success.
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