KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum Henderson Done Deal - Ngog on the way out?

I see what you mean Thundyr, but I don't think bring British makes you as loyal as you seem to suggest. I think 2 years down the line they will jump ship if a top 4 club come in for them, and we won't be one of those top 4 if we sign the likes of henderson downing and carroll for massively inflated prices.

People can argue fans moan when there's no money, moan when there is, but it is not pleasing nor is it impressive to spend 20 quid on something that's only worth a fiver. You wouldn't do it with your money, I wouldn't with mine, I don't want my club to do it with theirs (not aimed at you Thundyr by the way, just another point I had from reading another thread). If we get out alleged targets of downing, Henderson, Dann, and wickham we are likely to finish below spurs again. The more years that happens the harder it will be to get genuine talent, players much better than midtable british 'prospects'.

I think it's too early to pass judgement on players who are yet to play for a season under Kenny and Steve Clark. People are loyal to the man with the money it is true, but footballers like to compete at certain levels, and LFC is a club that aims to compete at the highest level within the next two years. That will be good enough for the vast majority of players we will be able to sign during this window. You're writing off our chances a little too early.

Lest I need remind you, Kenny took an 11 point disadvantage with only 18 games remaining and a "weakest of its generation" squad with an injured captain and no fit fullbacks, to within one game of making the Europa League in a season where only 1 place went to the EPL. Imagine what he can do if the players he buys are half as good as we hope they will be? Try to remember that Dalglish won his division in half the years he managed in England - I suspect he's got something that other managers lack, and that's a massive advantage for us over hacks like Redknapp in the long run.

LFC might not have the strongest squad even after potentially paying another 50m on more Hendersons, but if you cast an eye over the other top 5 clubs you'll see at least as many weaknesses as we have all papered over by rather fragile strength. I don't think we'll win the league next season, but I do think we're going to surprise a lot of people.

‘I'm going to go out on a limb and say any British player not from Manchester or London signing for Liverpool is not likely to leave to play for a rival of ours. Sure, they might go to Newcastle or Villa, but if they did it would be because they weren't good enough for us first. I'm not expecting these people to be like Gerrard or Carra, but I am expecting them to leave LFC only because the manager wanted someone better.’

Up until the last couple of years we always had that luxury. We consistently qualified for the CL (at least under Rafa) and obviously we are a massive club – but that only goes so far.

If we’re battling it out with say Tottenham for a player, they get the edge because they are playing in Europe and we’re not. That we’re a bigger clubs counts for nothing, especially with British players who always take a dim view of Liverpool, and not just because of our unpopularity in papers like The Sun.

‘The points about the players Benitez and Houllier bought also flounder in the wake that, while they were very good players when they were here, hardly any of them are still at the club. Only Reina and Kuyt remain of the "good" Rafa contingent - the rest have moved on, aren't really good enough, or are more or less permanently broken. This lack of continuity is one of the reasons why he have such a weak squad.’

No but given that Houllier first became Liverpool manager almost 15 years ago you wouldn’t expect many of his players to still be playing.

From the Benitez era we still have Agger, Skrtel, Johnson, Maxi Rodriguez and even Lucas in the squad. Not many of them (save Johnson) are likely to make the starting 11 but they are decent enough squad players

I agree that the lack of continuity is a problem – but unlike his predecessors Benitez never had any decent academy players to bolster his squad. Even those who look good now – like Spearing and Kelly – didn’t look particularly good prospects when rafa was in charge.

‘Which is why I said maybe we'll have a weaker, more expensive squad by buying British players at a time when their prices are massively inflated, but in 3 years time hopefully most of those players will be signing new contracts rather than the club needing to find replacements (and if we're finding replacements it's most likely because things didn't work out for them [eg Joe Cole], not because the player couldn't cut it in the EPL/England [eg Jovanovic]). We spend now so that we don't have to spend AGAIN later as well as running a lesser risk of high profile failures.’

I see your logic and it’s preferable to identifying players, making derisory offers, seeing them going off to another club, and then going back to our 3rd or 4th choice with our tale between our legs

It’s great that we are being proactive in the transfer market for once but the worry is that we are now paying waaay over the odds for players who haven’t yet proven their worth in the EPL, and we are only paying it because our main targets – whether they be English or foreign - are knocking us back because we’re seen as not good enough

That ought to worry any Liverpool fan

How do you know our main targets are knocking us back? Last I heard the only guy we've missed is Young, and no matter how you look at that any player worth his salt will happily sign for the league champions if they come knocking. Some will also say that Young would be a "nice-to-have" rather than a player we desperately need, which lends a certain credence to rumours that Commolli and co were only interested in him to a certain degree.

Any purchase is a risk. We are also *not* good enough; it's a valid assessment if that is indeed what players really think. But Manchester United can only buy so many players. Ditto Chelsea, Arsenal, and Man City. There are a lot of good players out there, and not all of them who want to move to England will find clubs that need them. I think we accept that players like Messi and Ronaldo are a step above, but if United are hot for Ashley Young (who is above average but no more) then I suspect we will be able to find someone who will fit in with our system now that we are actively trying to address the problems with our squad.

I'm not concerned that we will buy a bunch of flops, because if we look at our squad we have 15 or more in that category and we still managed to finish 6th despite Roy Hodgson's best efforts. Carroll is no worse than "can't jump" Crouch, yet we qualified for the CL for how many seasons with him leading the line alongside "always injured" Owen?

There's a distinct lack of hope in this forum today.

i' d pay a few mill to ger rid of ngog, i like him but turned into waste of a place

I highly rate N'gog and would value him around 19m so we only paid 1m for henderson. (yes i'm joking but it makes the fee more bareable).

Good thinking though Darren

yeah the rest is for cattermole lol

How do you work that one out?

anyone have the video of Henderson at melwood, I heard a video was released