KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum torres or masherano?

drome my man, spot on.

'torres is from madrid and supported (and played for) atletico. he moved to liverpool for money and glory.'

Not really as Torres took a pay cut to come to Liverpool, and he didn't win anything during his 42 months at the club

Your general point stands though. Neither Mascherano nor Torres are from England, let alone Liverpool, so expecting them to feel the same loyalty as fans or home-grown players like Gerrard, Carragher and Spearing is ludicrous

However, Torres brought this all on himself by publishing a book, which as his subsequent moves since have shown, was nothing but a complete pack of lies - trying to hoodwink Liverpool fans into believing he was as passionate about the clunb as they were

There was a time when Torres was fully comitted to Liverpool, (Mascherano main loyalty was always his wallet) but that was a long time ago and his equally untrue comment about being '100% commited to Liverpool' at the start of the season after more speculation linking him with a move away, was shown to be another lie as soon as he took to the pitch at the start of last season. You don't have be a genius to work out he didn't want to be here

Another slant is that in his first Chelsea press conference he said he had nothing but good words to say about Liverpool and has since gone on to criticise the club for anything he could think of from being too serious in training to not bowing to Mascherano's want-away demands

Few will agree witj me but personally I think he's worse than Michael Owen because at least Owen would have preferred to have come back to us (over United) which was never going to happen under Rafa, whereas Torres obviously hates the club and its fans with an absolute passion - for nothing else than defining the word '[oops]' since moving to Chavski

It would be nice to think Liverpool fans show how they feel wgen he next visits Anfield as a Chelsea player but perhaps that's just wishful thinking

well i'm sure when he left madrid that he couldn't have forseen the fact that our club would baulk in the transfer market so badly under gillet and hicks and that the club would so grossly mismanagaged. also at the end of his 42 months at LFC he was earning far more than any other atletico player was at that point. In fact by his second season at LFC, he was earning more than he was being paid when he left atletico.

his autobiography (as anyone's) is always going to talk about how much he loves the club he's currently playing for. as for the 'i'm 100% committed' etc, i never really buy that anyway.

there is rarely a day goes by in the news where some footballer doesn't commit 100% to the club. and they so often back track. i'm not saying it's good, but i am saying that this is the modern game. we are sold spin on websites, newspapers in order to sell ads. in other words, i personally took torres leaving with a grain of salt.

i beleive that the hurt wasn't necessarily about the manner in whihc he left but more that he went to a rival or ours that's higher up the table. it was confirmation that after years of bad leadership (at board, ownership, and to a lesser extent at managerial level), that we were no longer a top 4 club. and that a club who operate under the assumption that they will be in the top 4, ie chelsea, were able to take him from us. i beleive his leaving was a manifestation of things that have been happening at the club for 20 years.

so when he next visits anfield as a chelsea player, would i show him how i feel? of course i would. but i wouldn't be boo-ing him or opening him with welcome arms either. he's just someone who scored sh**loads of goals for us, gave us a £26m profit and then went to another club. i don't see the issue. still.

of course players comit themselves 100% to their current employers everyday - but writing a book saying you identify yourself with the ideals of the club you have joined (despite the fact you don't), is taking it one step further

It's less spin - more an outright lie - as he showed when he joined the most plastic and fake club you could find in Chelsea

It jusyt paints an accurate picture of Torres which is completely at odds with the false image he tried to portray himself as to Liverpool fans

And his contempt for the club since leaving - by a string of criticism - shows that every word in his book was a lie - a lie he told to make money

Yes he made us £26m and was f**** incredible durring his first two seasons, but I have nothing but utter contempt for him and the club he joined as I'm delighted that thus far in his Chelsea career he's been the biggest waste of £50m a club has ever spent

Hes gone already for goodness sake. His form started to dip during the world cup. Never regained his scoring ability after that. Yeah he did score some wonderful goals but not as much as the first season we got him. He is going to be the next Shevcenko i reckon. Its better to move foward then sulking about his departure. Lets give him a 'standing ovation' when he visits Anfield next season. Make sure he [oops] his pants off.

As is often said although in my opinion he was just and deadly in the next 18 months

If there was a turning point it was the injury he picked up in the Autumn of 2009 after almost single-handedly defeating the likes of Hull and West Ham.

He didn't seem quite as good from then on but however badly he's performed ast Chelsea people forget he actually scored 3 goals in his last two games for us

His goal agaist blackburn, chesea and arsenal were among the best he socred.

money comes first and foremost for 99% of the players,

can you blame them? no but why not just tell the truth and say i came here for the feckin great 150 grand a week wage lol atleast your'e being honest after all and no lying to millions of people who adore you

i agree, this is what i think, the top foreign players will not be with any club through thick and thin, they will relish the wins and the trophies but when it comes down to a re-build or rough stage, MOSTof them will quit, (reina stayed) what im trying to say is, u cant really blame them for leaving, we may be upset, heartbroke whatever

But they arent stevie G or carra, they r players who like a "new challenge" (they all seem to say that) or the money

not sure it all made sense but yeah

I repsect them about the same amount, which is very little

Torres - forced his transfer through last minute in January, to a rival club. And played with a grumpy face for a season and a half, but he never refused to play, he still went out there on the pitch

Mascherano - forced his transfer through by refusing to play. But did go to a better side, who are not rivals. And of course he dedicated the win over Man Utd to us LFC fans.

In all, they both need to do a lot more to gain any respect from me.