KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum Form is temporary, crap is permanent

I want an attacking team as much as anyone, I prefered the 87/88 team to the the great 79 team even though the 79 team is quite rightly regarded as the best Liverpool team of all time simply because the 87/88 team was more exciting to watch. The point I am making is that it's going to take Roy alot longer than five months to turn the playing style around and put his own mark on the team, like I have said previously Arsene Wenger took a few seasons to change Arsenal's style of play around from when Bruce Rioch and George Graham had it. Lets just give Roy the same time and finances as our previous managers Houllier, Evans and Benitez have had before we judge him, thats the only fair way to see if he's a failure, it's impossible to call him that after such a short space of time.

The point I am making is that it's going to take Roy alot longer than five months to turn the playing style around and put his own mark on the team, like I have said previously Arsene Wenger took a few seasons to change Arsenal's style of play around from when Bruce Rioch and George Graham had it. Lets just give Roy the same time and finances as our previous managers Houllier, Evans and Benitez have had before we judge him, thats the only fair way to see if he's a failure, it's impossible to call him that after such a short space of time.[/quote]

The players Roy is coaching are professional and all play a different style of football when they play internationals (and many of them do) and they seem to adjust to those tactics relatively quickly. If a manager can't get a squad to play his style of football in 5 months then, in my opinion, he's not going to!! When you have players who want to attack and are told to sit back and wait for opposition sides to come attack them so they can defend it takes away their natural game. Yes they should be able to change because they are professionals but i'm sure it gets them very frustrated and they begin to lose heart!

exactly. if we feel like this from just watching them play then the players are going to be even worse. espeailly the attack minded players....roy is digging a hole for him self and it gets deeper with each game....

Ceb! your right, roy must have dug through to auatralia by now? I dont like insulting Roy but even if we win a few games the fans have not taken to him! he just hasnt got our culture, and try as i might, i want to believe in him i dont think i ever will now, we need a strong positve leader! roy isnt one.

Reclaim - with respect we all agree that this bunch of players under performed last season? so why do we allow the situation to get worse and not better. We are judging Roy on what he has done in the past as well as the present. Many posters highlighted before he became manager that his style of play was incredibly negative and would not suit Liverpool, they were right. He has made comments where he feels fans expectations of finsishing towards/in the top are too high. He feels a win at Everton would be 'Utopia' and a draw away at Birmingham a good result. He has also stated that he will not change as this has put him in good stead for the last 35yrs, therefore this is not a manager evolving or adapting to the role. The man is 63 and has one trick, defend deep and sneak a goal, we have seen it now and it is time for him to move on. I stated on a thread the other day for fans to visit Fulham fansites and they will tell you about Roy and his tactics. Yes they liked him but Hughes is a class above and the football is far better than ever. quote ' we even look good away'

Well if you want to judge managers as being bad because things never worked out at a previous Club then how did Brian Clough arrive at Forest after beings sacked after about 6 games for Leeds United and If Roy is too old at 60 to be managing the Club what do you say to these people calling for Dalglish who is 60 and fuc*ed up his previous managerial job's at Newcastle and Celtic.

Good Luck would do!

clough got the job because he made derby in to a top team. he left leeds because the dressing room and board didn't like him.


i believe people want dalgish because they believe he'll come and play attacking football...erm remind me RECLAIM who was the manager of your preferred liverpool team of the past.....im not saying kenny is the answer i'd hate for his legendary status at the club to be tarnished but you do not make a good case to keep roy on as manager

@Reclaim (and emp etc) Maybe we've gone off on a tangent here, so let's try to agree on a few things first, otherwise we're never going to solve this dispute.

a) Roy Hodgson does not play to win.
Still with me? Thought not, so I'll have to break it down for ya.

i) Liverpool are sent out to defend. I hope that you have enough footballing knowledge to understand this point at least. We do not attack the ball, we allow the opposition space and time to use it as they wish, and trust in our ability to get 6-8 men behind the ball and block their attacks in the final third.
ii) When the attack breaks down, we plan to counter-attack via route 1 ball, but we lack a target man which is why Roy was so keen on buying one. So rather than abandon that plan we instead have no plan as to how to get the ball to the striker, and we have no capable wide players either, which is why we are forced to hoof it so much.
iii) i + ii = we will fail to dominate possession. Possession is everything - teams that boss possession do lose on occasion, but usually only because they have failed to take their many chances (consider how Man U should have completely destroyed us earlier this season given all the possession they squandered, and in the end almost gave us a point).
iv) If you do not plan to dominate possession, you do not plan to win. You will have fewer chances on goal, you will have to fend off more shots on goal, will have more corners and dangerous free kicks against you, and your defenders stand a greater chance of making a costly mistake. Unless your defensive players are all on form, conceding from set pieces, deflected strikes, or own goals will be your likely downfall.

Ergo: Roy Hodgson does not play to win. He plays to not lose, which is a different thing entirely.

b) Liverpool FC and the players bought by it are interested only in winning. Many, if not most, of the fans might like pretty football, but the club and the players want silverware. We agree here, surely.

a + b = disaster waiting to happen. Everything we are seeing here stems from this - Torres and Reina sulking, Pacheco wanting out, Agger never playing CB, poor results, general lack of teamwork, and low morale.

If you substitute LFC for a mid-table club, where winning isn't everything (eg Fulham), Hodgson has a chance to succeed. He's a capable enough manager in the right circumstances, but at LFC he's simply the wrong man for the job and he ISN'T PREPARED TO CHANGE. We need someone who at least has the right mindset. Not all the issues will go away with a new appointment, but right now we're on a hiding to nothing.

"Well if you want to judge managers as being bad because things never worked out at a previous Club then how did Brian Clough arrive at Forest after beings sacked after about 6 games for Leeds United and If Roy is too old at 60 to be managing the Club what do you say to these people calling for Dalglish who is 60 and fuc*ed up his previous managerial job's at Newcastle and Celtic"

You forgot to mention Blackburn,where Kenny managed to win the league.