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come on Chris, your young inexperience is getting the better of you mate, I asked you what you think the highest level a club player can play at, is it the top level of there domestic league or is it the champions league, which one is it? I'm bored, read back through your posts and you'll find you have compared Steve Bull to Michael Owen, thats laughable and proves a serious lack of knowledge about top level football. I'm hardly young and I clearly know a lot more about football as I've proved countless times already. well if you have all this knowledge please tell me what the highest level you can play at in club football, is it your domestic league or champions league... Perhaps this is too big of a concept for you to grasp, but clubs play in multiple competitions. Liverpool compete and have competed in the first division which is the highest level of domestic football. Playing for Liverpool means competing at the highest level domestically because they play in the highest division as well as the other competitions. Suarez and Owen were playing there in the first division, ergo they were playing at the highest level possible domestically. As such, Suarez winning the golden boot, winning the PFA player of the year award and tying Shearer and Ronaldo's record of goals scored in a single season (without pens mind you) is a world class achievement, being recognized as the best player in one of the best leagues in the world. This resulted in the best team in the world, Barcelona, buying him for one of the highest fees in history. Now stay with me, while Liverpool compete in the Premier league, they also compete in cup competitions. Michael Owen was recognized as the best player in Europe by UEFA in 2001 because of his performances that resulted in Liverpool winning the FA Cup, League Cup, and UEFA cup. Competing in the highest division domestically? Check. Winning trophies? Check. Competing in Europe? Check. Recognition as a world class talent by a panel of non-biased, non Liverpool football experts? Check. He also several times won the golden boot, premier league player of the year, and various other awards and accolades. This is what made Real Madrid buy him in the first place. Whether or not he succeeded at Madrid is irrelevant. Neither did Kaka; does that mean he was never a world class player? Of course not. His achievements at Milan didn't make it go away simply because he didn't fit in a Madrid, which are a Circus of a club that buy every class player they can get ahold of, whether they fit or not. Many world class players have not performed at other clubs: Rush at Juventus, Shevchenko at Chelsea, Forlan at United, the list goes on. Owen was world class at Liverpool, and he has a Ballon D'Orand a cabinet full of trophies and other awards to prove it.
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 8,564
1st Team Squad
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As far as the OP, Suarez, Torres, Gerrard, Alonso, Mascherano, Fowler, McManaman, Owen, and Hyypia were all world class in recent years for us.
There are also many other players like Garcia, Carragher, Riise, and the like that were either there or very close. Coutinho and Sturridge probably fall into that category.
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 7,291
1st Team Squad
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1st Team Squad
Joined: Sep 2011
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Perhaps this is too big of a concept for you to grasp, but clubs play in multiple competitions. Liverpool compete and have competed in the first division which is the highest level of domestic football. Playing for Liverpool means competing at the highest level domestically because they play in the highest division as well as the other competitions.
Suarez and Owen were playing there in the first division, ergo they were playing at the highest level possible domestically. As such, Suarez winning the golden boot, winning the PFA player of the year award and tying Shearer and Ronaldo's record of goals scored in a single season (without pens mind you) is a world class achievement, being recognized as the best player in one of the best leagues in the world. This resulted in the best team in the world, Barcelona, buying him for one of the highest fees in history.
Now stay with me, while Liverpool compete in the Premier league, they also compete in cup competitions. Michael Owen was recognized as the best player in Europe by UEFA in 2001 because of his performances that resulted in Liverpool winning the FA Cup, League Cup, and UEFA cup. Competing in the highest division domestically? Check. Winning trophies? Check. Competing in Europe? Check. Recognition as a world class talent by a panel of non-biased, non Liverpool football experts? Check. He also several times won the golden boot, premier league player of the year, and various other awards and accolades. This is what made Real Madrid buy him in the first place.
Whether or not he succeeded at Madrid is irrelevant. Neither did Kaka; does that mean he was never a world class player? Of course not. His achievements at Milan didn't make it go away simply because he didn't fit in a Madrid, which are a Circus of a club that buy every class player they can get ahold of, whether they fit or not. Many world class players have not performed at other clubs: Rush at Juventus, Shevchenko at Chelsea, Forlan at United, the list goes on. Owen was world class at Liverpool, and he has a Ballon D'Orand a cabinet full of trophies and other awards to prove it.
Very well said.
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As far as the OP, Suarez, Torres, Gerrard, Alonso, Mascherano, Fowler, McManaman, Owen, and Hyypia were all world class in recent years for us.
There are also many other players like Garcia, Carragher, Riise, and the like that were either there or very close. Coutinho and Sturridge probably fall into that category. was Wayne Rooney World class at Everton or Duncan Ferguson...
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If you have something to say, say it. These leading rhetorical questions aren't proving anything, and you've asked them before in this thread. You had no retort in the debate we were having, so now you're latching onto this and trying to throw spanners in the works again, instead of actually making an argument.
Last edited by redordead13; 22/02/16 11:20 PM.
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If you have something to say, say it. These leading rhetorical questions aren't proving anything, and you've asked them before in this thread. You had no retort in the debate we were having, so now you're latching onto this and trying to throw spanners in the works again, instead of actually making an argument. You are mentioning quite a few names there who have not played at or not achieved enough at the highest level while at Liverpool Alonso and Mascherano have gone on to greater things, Suarez seems to be doing it now but the likes of Gerrard's and Big Sami never achieved enough at the highest level to be put alongside Xaxi and Inniesta midfielder wise or in Big Sami's case Carnavaro or Maldini's or even Fowler alongside a Shevchenko or Raul. The others you mentioned like Garcia and Riise well you are just being ridiculous or you have a very, very low opinion about the level of world class. I asked about Rooney and Ferguson because Everton fans loved those two players too and as good as they were for Everton they also never played enough at the higher level because Everton did not provide them with the platform
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Its not like Gerrard or Hyypia played in a Champions League final and ended up with winners medals is it? Don't think you can get a higher level than that.
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I suppose levels are in some ways like climbing mountains in that just because you climbed it once doesn't mean you can climb it again as you could of been lucky or something whereas a person who climbs it five or six times has demonstrated his class and ability on numerous occasions so can't be put on the same level as the person who did it once. Bit like Gerrard and Big Sami they both showed us that they could do it once and reach the very top winning it but never had the ability to reach that level again and fell short whereas Xavi, Inniesta KAKA, Carnevaro and Pierlo demonstrated there ability to succeed at the highest level time and time again. This is what I mean about levels...
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Under 23 Player
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I suppose levels are in some ways like climbing mountains in that just because you climbed it once doesn't mean you can climb it again as you could of been lucky or something whereas a person who climbs it five or six times has demonstrated his class and ability on numerous occasions so can't be put on the same level as the person who did it once. Bit like Gerrard and Big Sami they both showed us that they could do it once and reach the very top winning it but never had the ability to reach that level again and fell short whereas Xavi, Inniesta KAKA, Carnevaro and Pierlo demonstrated there ability to succeed at the highest level time and time again. This is what I mean about levels... It's a pity many world class chelsea players won the CL twice, both times on shootouts otherwise your argument would be fairly amusing right now.
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We could just go north to Manchester and realize a lot of their world class players only won it once.
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