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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243
Under 23 Player
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Under 23 Player
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243 |
The worst home form in my living memory, is not reason to give him another chance. Time's up for Kenny.
As for the players you suggest go out, well Aquilani, Cole, Kuyt and Maxi are all better than Henderson and Spearing. Henderson might improve, but still seems like you're weakening the squad with those. really? are we not creating chances without them at the moment? aquilani and cole are as good as gone anyway. kuyt and maxi haven't had much game time this season. both have an inability to beat players. as much as i love the effort kuyt puts in i just think he'll play less games if we bring in a good right winger and striker. maxi has some good link up play in attack and chips in with a few goals but for squad players both are on very substantial contracts and hardly playing. would rather see us bring some young players through than see the current squad players under perform at a costly price. personally i'd like to see us have pace on the wings, thats what going to get the best out of carroll & suarez. bale/lennon at spurs are a dangerous pair, both quick and can take players on. scoring goals is our biggest weakness, so looking at ways to get the best out of our current pair of strikers is going to weaken the squad? i think thats a little harsh on spearing, he's young, hasn't played a lot of first team football and has been thrown in the deep end with lucas' injury and adam's inability to make a tackle/keep up with the opposition. would rather have him at the club as backup for lucas and feature in the europa league than go out and spend £8m-£12m on a player who may not get a game all season. just bear in mind that when fit lucas is usually the first name on the team sheet.
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,886
Under 23 Player
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Under 23 Player
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,886 |
If you look at the top 6 positions and points this season it's starting to show a top4 then another 2 making the gulf even wider.
The point in regard the failings that have been signed is this. Can we have so many in the starting 11 next season to see if they improve?
If you're not on the money in every position week in week out now you lose or draw games even against the lesser teams. You can manage to just about make room for one e.g. Lucas and hope they improve.
Honestly, can we afford to be carrying Henderson, Carroll , Adam even Downing in a starting 11 game after game 'hoping they improve' next season with arguably more spent and improvements in those placed top 6 now?
Someone tell me from 1-6 in the Premier League who is being carried? Ironically I can think only of Torres off the top of my head but Chelsea are bang on everywhere else and still only sixth, that is more than a concern.
If this season shows anything to me it's you can't. I don't believe either that given the same team another manager couldn't have got more out of them. As the weeks and lack of progress has become more evident I think that has also become clear.
FSG as a business are bound to ask themselves how much more investment can we risk here? The answer should be obvious if we put emotions aside.
Sadly, Kenny to stand down end of season as I want it done right. Any manager good enough has the time in the summer to get it sorted by kick off game 1.
Last edited by Top4; 24/04/12 10:56 AM.
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.
George Washington
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243
Under 23 Player
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Under 23 Player
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243 |
The worst home form in my living memory, is not reason to give him another chance. Time's up for Kenny.
As for the players you suggest go out, well Aquilani, Cole, Kuyt and Maxi are all better than Henderson and Spearing. Henderson might improve, but still seems like you're weakening the squad with those. really? are we not creating chances without them at the moment? aquilani and cole are as good as gone anyway. kuyt and maxi haven't had much game time this season. both have an inability to beat players. as much as i love the effort kuyt puts in i just think he'll play less games if we bring in a good right winger and striker. maxi has some good link up play in attack and chips in with a few goals but for squad players both are on very substantial contracts and hardly playing. would rather see us bring some young players through than see the current squad players under perform at a costly price. personally i'd like to see us have pace on the wings, thats what going to get the best out of carroll & suarez. bale/lennon at spurs are a dangerous pair, both quick and can take players on. scoring goals is our biggest weakness, so looking at ways to get the best out of our current pair of strikers is going to weaken the squad? i think thats a little harsh on spearing, he's young, hasn't played a lot of first team football and has been thrown in the deep end with lucas' injury and adam's inability to make a tackle/keep up with the opposition. would rather have him at the club as backup for lucas and feature in the europa league than go out and spend £8m-£12m on a player who may not get a game all season. just bear in mind that when fit lucas is usually the first name on the team sheet. We create SOME chances yes, but clearly not enough, otherwise we wouldn't have such a low goal total. You can put some of it down to bad finishing/bad luck but not all of it. It's quite apparent to me we don't actually create enough. PArticularly at home. You might be right about maxi, kuyt etc being on larger wages, but what difference does that make to squad strength. You cutting the wage bill or the ability? Aquilani is too soft for the premiership, but he's still 10 times the player Spearing is. Kuyt has been solid ( never spectacular) right winger for us for years under Benitez and always weighed in with a fair few goals, but you can't say the same of Henderson. Yes I'd rather see us bring promising youngsters through, but Spearing isn't one of those. He's played varying amounts for the past 4 years, and he's 23 now, not so young, and he's not promising in the slightest. Everything about him is average. I agree that Aquilani and Cole will be on their way anyway. But you'll never convince me that getting rid of Kuyt, Maxi, Aquilani and Cole in favour of keeping Spearing is increasing the squad's ability. would a creative midfielder, a winger and a striker not address that problem? it doesn't matter how strong it makes the squad on paper really does it? the results haven't come and kuyt and maxi have hardly played and haven't performed all that well imo. i think spearing is good enough to play backup to the ever present lucas when fit. not a great player by any stretch but what do we do? go and spend out transfer kitty on a defensive midfielder who will sit on the bench or keep lucas out of the side? or address the reality of our problem which is scoring goals?
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 8,163
1st Team Squad
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1st Team Squad
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 8,163 |
Cups are not entirely luck no but you do need an element of luck they are one off games. Bu certainly they are not a barometer of success. Particularly when the cups are at the expense of our league form. I would swap 4th place for the Carling Cup all day long. If say we were 5th and just missed out on 4th I could accept it but this season has been a total disaster and anyone trying to put a gloss on it to protect the king is fooling no one but themselves. do you think your Anti-Kenny agenda is making you think that anyone who finds a positive in our team is pro Kenny? Recognize has not written a glowing endorsement of Kenny but has said that the season as a whole has been ok (league aside). You read it as pro kenny So....apart from being crap in the league our season has been ok?? to the majority, the league IS the season and is the one the 'only' thing that we need to get right, hence ken's target of 4th place which he has missed by miles!! domestic cups are just cosmetic.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 27,628
Liverpool Legend
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Liverpool Legend
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 27,628 |
I did not see that! so apart from the league the season has been ok? oh my god. Things are worse than I thought
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 144
Under 16 Player
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Under 16 Player
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 144 |
Out of all the pathetic signings the one i desperately didnt want was Downing and nothing has changed my view in fact it has just been enhanced. He cant beat a man and has no heart. Will not battle and goes missing.
Roll on the summer and hope many changes are on the way. Don't want to be dreading the same as this year come August and with Kenny in charge we are going nowhere.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 27,628
Liverpool Legend
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Liverpool Legend
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 27,628 |
I think you are right Rafa. Kenny was always an average (at best) manager before he took his decade sabatical. Quite why anyone thinks he is going to improve after all this time I don't know. Being a premiership manager these days is very hard its never been more competative or with so many complexities. We need a new manager but we must choose with care and great thought befoehand. The last two appointments were a right hash we simply cannot afford to repeat that.
Last edited by Stanley Park; 24/04/12 05:51 PM.
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,416
Moderator
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Moderator
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,416 |
I think you are right Rafa. Kenny was always an average (at best) manager before he took his decade sabatical. Quite why anyone thinks he is going to improve after all this time I don't know. Being a premiership manager these days is very hard its never been more competative or with so many complexities. We need a new manager but we must choose with care and great thought befoehand. The last two appointments were a right hash we simply cannot afford to repeat that. Yes Stanley I agree,unfortunately people in positions of power have made shocking decisions in the recent past,wether you believed in Rafa or not,he should not have been replaced with someone of the caliber of Roy Hodgson,and yes,Roy never stood a chance or got long enough. Now,if your a Kenny supporter,it is still obvious that this season has been a major let down league wise,if John Henry and Co want a new man then there is not much more to be said unless it is an absolute disaster of an appointment. I would not be fully convinced that there is somebody capable and not in it for the money willing to join Liverpool FC,sacking a manager for the sake of it is pointless,any new manager is the far more important decision.
"Romance has broke down This boy is crack'in up"
So not a moderator
Valar Morghulis
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243
Under 23 Player
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Under 23 Player
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,243 |
A right winger and another striker might help. But it won't solve the problem. Not without a new approach to how we play football and how we train. If Kenny could make that change, I'd be happy to see him stay, but I don't think he can.
It doesn't matter which players you have if you don't play them to their strengths, or have a flawed approach to the game. Even with the players we've got, Kenny doesn't play them properly. The training seems to be good with regard to short passing, but not really with regard to shooting, crossing, fitness, set pieces, tactical awareness and so on. So it looks pretty, but it fails.
Looking at the squad, which players have improved on last year, including the new signings? Skrtel? That's really about it isn't it? And the majority have performed much worse, even the youngsters who you'd expect to improve. That's a problem, a big one.
IN terms of goals, Maxi has 6 in 16 games, and last year got 10. Dirk Kuyt every year has scored 10-15 goals for us. Even this year though he hasn't played all that much, he still has 5. So given that we need goals, rather than play 4-5-1 and spearing in a defensive midfield role, shouldn't we be at least playing one of Kuyt or Maxi? We don't need a defensive midfielder. Our problem isn't defensive.
So no, I don't think whoever we sign will fix this. Kenny will either not play him, or play him out of position, or let him become worse as a player from training, or just have bad tactics which essentially will make the new right winger and striker look less good than they really are.
well your slating kenny for the teams performance in the league so let's use league stats for players because "the cups don't count" as i keep hearing a lot of you saying. Dirky Kuyt has actually made 30 appearances in the league which includes 9 sub appearances and has scored 2 goals and has 1 assist. if you want to deem that good enough and use the manager as a scapegoat then thats your decision mate. but to me that is an issue that needs to be addressed. i think kuyt has been a good servant to the club, i admire the effort he puts in but he lacks everything apart from an engine and tracking back. you have a point about maxi, he's scored 4 goals in 7(2) but hasn't set up any goals. he's nearing 32 and will most probably lose more pace from his game soon. i'd still prefer us to sign someone who is flamboyant and posses pace and can put the ball in the box where it is needed. i agree our problem isn't defensive and we don't need another defensive midfield player. but it has been an issue for us with the injury of lucas. without a player who can sit in front of the defence we are very poor... just look at our away game against bolton this season and you'll get the picture. i'm not saying jay spearing is a long term figure of the squad, but he can provide useful backup when called upon and won't be too unhappy about being on the bench when lucas starts ahead of him. he can also do a job for us in the europa league next season.
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 204
Under 16 Player
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Under 16 Player
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 204 |
In case you are the new in this forum which i think you are, before all this bad performances
1-we won Champion League Cup 2-we qualify 5 times consecutively for CL 3-we got a FA cup, Super UEFA cup too.
To think that the above manager who have given us those are still not good enough to come back, i am extremely puzzled how can the current one is allowed to stay...
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