KopTalk.com Forums Football Liverpool FC Forum What is the bare minimum expectations

Now let me see Dunne moved this summer and was linked to Sunderland ...and signed for Everton.... Doyle... signed for Wolves... Mascheranno interests Barcelona (probably the best team in Europe at the moment) and this week Juventos ... I think the links sum up the class of the players. Its not by chance the best players move to the best clubs...

i thought dunne signed for villa???

Im refering to the period Rafa started here 2005 to now, Wenger has won what? Rafa has won what?

Wenger won the title, yes, how long ago?

You refer to wenger winning in style? If our win in istanbul was not style, then i dont know what it will take to put our fans on a buzz! We have even ended up higher than wengers team in few seasons Rafa has been here. The same style with the FA Cup win. Arsenal have the style, we have the siverware. We also lost a carling cup final under Rafa, and we won a super cup. We lost fifa world club cup. Im sure arsenal would envy us for playing in that many finals and opprtunities to win finals.

You cant compare wengers whole period to RAFA, you got rememer we had houlier here too during part of wengers stay

Very strong words here, i havent heard any of our ledgens attack the manager this way. Erm, if Rafa doesnt give teh 2nd string players a chance, he gets slaughterd, if Rafa gives a 3rd choice player a chance, that player makes mistakes, the fans say Rafa is inept, he has no planning. So how do you please everyone? He bought Aqyilani, that was teh ebst he could do with the money he had, he has a vision and a sight for a player he wants, so lets see what happens with aquilani, if it is a repeat of Keane, then id agree with you, Rafa made a balls up. But the names of dunne and doyle, thise are players for mid table teams yea. Guys we want are the guys who are most sought after, mascherano is wanted buy spains biggest clubs, italian clubs too. AQUILANI WAS chased by chelsea and a spanish team. for sure. Lucas is a kid.

I would love to see if spearing made the same mistakes as lucas, how would the fans attack him.

This is why have respect for Rafa, cos to me he seems like a man with a hard head. yea. He gets bashed for zonal, for lucas, for others, but he still goies about his business for sure. Very admiral quality that.

In a way i agree. If you belive in something you should go on with it no matter what anyone else think of you.

But at the same time Rafa is in a situation were he has responibility for a team which millions and millions follow week in week out. If he had a job were his ideas and his stubbornness didn't effect everyone else i would fully agree with you.

But that's not the case here. His stubbornness has cost us a lot. He's only a human being and everyone makes mistakes, but it would be nice to see him learning from his mistakes from time to time, and not just carry on with his ideas in blind faith that it will turn out good someday.

well, lets see where we end up.. still early days, this is a huge month for us

IMHO it is hard to compare Rafa and Wenger but if you do want to compare trophies, Wenger has the upper hand

Rafa i think is the better tactician while Wenger is a perhaps one of the greatest mentors for his players.

I remember reading once the criteria Wenger sets out for his scouts. Speed, technique, passing and physical abilities are all important before they are even considered for Arsenal's famed academy. If you look at their entire academy, they all play the same type of football the first team plays and that has Wenger's signature all over it.

He is simply of the best.

Yes Wenger is certainly a great manager and true about their youth policy but Rafa has only gained control of ours this summer.

And of course its easy to admire certain things from the outside. I'm pretty sure on Arsenal forums they're talking about Wengers stubborness and why doesnt he sign a defensive midfielder and some experienced players to help the youngsters along.

And Arsenal havent won anything for longer than us ...the grass is always greener

bit unfair to blame wenger for those things though - after all he has his hands tied by the new stadium and the unexpected costs involved with building it ....... he never had a problem with experienced players in the past and i don't think he does now either to be honest - i believe he is just trying to work the best he can with the club's financial constraints and believes younger players that can be sold in the future for decent money are more worthwhile than older players that might win you a trophy but are worthless on the resale market

sob i feel the same way about rafa. lol