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#638603 - 03/09/21 09:55 AM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 27416
Loc: Not the EU
Yes you are correct to a point. But the new government can still make foreign policy. A classic example is brexit the UK government is re-negotiating with the EU over Northern Ireland protocol.

The Taliban hold fewer cards than we think they are in grave danger of the government collapsing and the country ending up in civil war and or total breakdown.

So they need the west Biden could have negotiated a more stable withdrawal quite easy and maybe renegotiated more stable terms. In fact any responsible or competent president would have done. I also read many of bidens military advisers were opposed to his stance
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#638612 - 04/09/21 02:36 PM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 22504
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Yes you are correct to a point. But the new government can still make foreign policy. A classic example is brexit the UK government is re-negotiating with the EU over Northern Ireland protocol.

The Taliban hold fewer cards than we think they are in grave danger of the government collapsing and the country ending up in civil war and or total breakdown.

So they need the west Biden could have negotiated a more stable withdrawal quite easy and maybe renegotiated more stable terms. In fact any responsible or competent president would have done. I also read many of bidens military advisers were opposed to his stance


You cannot compare the EU to the Taliban, the EU was not in war with UK, you are really talking crap now, how can you even compare that? Maybe you should ask yourself why Trump negotiated such a deal, that said, unless the US wanted to stay there for maybe a full generation, I can't see how it could have been otherwise, the Afghan governments have always been corrupt and unreliable.

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#638616 - 05/09/21 11:50 AM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 27416
Loc: Not the EU
I was not comparing the EU to the Taliban merely giving the example of where international agreements can be renegotiated. Biden had ample opportunity to amend whatever bush agreed particularly as the Taliban need foreign aid to stop their country from collapsing.

Read and understand what I said before blowing your top.
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IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#638639 - 06/09/21 07:08 PM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 22504
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I was not comparing the EU to the Taliban merely giving the example of where international agreements can be renegotiated. Biden had ample opportunity to amend whatever bush agreed particularly as the Taliban need foreign aid to stop their country from collapsing.

Read and understand what I said before blowing your top.


Exactly what I said, international agreements can be renegotiated if both parties are willing. What could Biden have told the Taliban to renegotiate, we changed governments? What Boris did with the EU is not something normal, but the EU wanted an orderly withdrawal and the majority of MPs were not happy with May's deal. For the US, Afghanistan had become a huge problem, the majority of Anericans wanted their army back. In any case, what did you want Biden to renegotiate, to stay there?

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#638640 - 06/09/21 08:07 PM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 27416
Loc: Not the EU
Biden could have negotiated an orderly withdrawal not my opinion the whole world feels that including Democrat america he could have set conditions on the withdrawal. The 1975 Saigon evacuation was seen as a disaster but compared to Biden it was highly efficient in 1975 American ditched weapons in the sea today the Taliban have American black hawks and heavy artillery. Biden could have negotiated safe passage there are still American British and European citizens stuck in Afghanistan.

I get you donít like trump but that doesnít mean you have to defend the dangerously incompetent man who replaced him
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#638642 - 06/09/21 10:19 PM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: Stanley Park]
EMP Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 05/04/12
Posts: 9433
Loc: Eire
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Biden could have negotiated an orderly withdrawal not my opinion the whole world feels that including Democrat america he could have set conditions on the withdrawal. The 1975 Saigon evacuation was seen as a disaster but compared to Biden it was highly efficient in 1975 American ditched weapons in the sea today the Taliban have American black hawks and heavy artillery. Biden could have negotiated safe passage there are still American British and European citizens stuck in Afghanistan.

I get you donít like trump but that doesnít mean you have to defend the dangerously incompetent man who replaced him



lol dangerously incompetent --this from a man who lauds boris lol.. uk is literally going to end, its in the toilet and u making remarks about biden lol

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#638643 - 07/09/21 02:28 AM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 22504
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Biden could have negotiated an orderly withdrawal not my opinion the whole world feels that including Democrat america he could have set conditions on the withdrawal. The 1975 Saigon evacuation was seen as a disaster but compared to Biden it was highly efficient in 1975 American ditched weapons in the sea today the Taliban have American black hawks and heavy artillery. Biden could have negotiated safe passage there are still American British and European citizens stuck in Afghanistan.

I get you donít like trump but that doesnít mean you have to defend the dangerously incompetent man who replaced him



Do you think anybody told Biden that the Taliban would take over the country in a week? I don't even understand why there were still so many US and UK citizens when everybody knew that the army was withdrawing more than a year before it happened, in fact, the withdrawal was postponed by 3 months. What were they waiting for ti leave? I think everybody thought the Afghan army would be able to resist for at least a few months and especially in Kabul. As for Saigon, it was completely different, the government in power was not pro American.

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#638645 - 07/09/21 11:23 AM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 27416
Loc: Not the EU
I donít think the government in power today is pro American and has done long term and possibly permanent damage to American influence Russia and China can not believe their luck.

Presidents are not judged on excuses they are judged on results.

And this is a historic disaster and bidens responsibility
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IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#638650 - 07/09/21 05:07 PM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 22504
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I donít think the government in power today is pro American and has done long term and possibly permanent damage to American influence Russia and China can not believe their luck.

Presidents are not judged on excuses they are judged on results.

And this is a historic disaster and bidens responsibility


What luck Russia got from US withdrawal from Afghanistan? China will have access to copper mines, but Russia, not sure what you mean. As for results, what do you think the US citizens expected in Afghanistan, I understand the majority were for the withdrawal

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#638653 - 08/09/21 10:18 AM Re: What widely believed historical "fact" is actually ... [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 27416
Loc: Not the EU
Russia wonít benefit from the return of Afghanistan to a rouge state given it borders it. But both Russia and China will decline from American world influence following the rapid decline under Biden.

America is weak with a president who is probably not a well man health wise.

That leaves the door open for China and Russia. Sadly China is well on track to be the worlds superpower and I feel for future generations.
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