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#635476 - 28/09/20 07:52 AM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Stanley Park]
Pickles Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 23/12/15
Posts: 4970
Attacking players are going to go for the easy option when in the opposing box and flick the ball at defending team players arms. I know I would to gain an easy penalty!

Whilst referees have no room for discretion over this handball rule, expect a lot more penalties awarded this season.

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#635482 - 28/09/20 10:47 AM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Pickles]
ecnirp98 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 5567
Loc: Madchester
Originally Posted By Pickles
Attacking players are going to go for the easy option when in the opposing box and flick the ball at defending team players arms. I know I would to gain an easy penalty!

Whilst referees have no room for discretion over this handball rule, expect a lot more penalties awarded this season.


Must be great for attackers, as they can flick the ball onto an arm/hand as you say, or if you look at some of the Spurs defenders they had their hands behind their back, which must affect their balance and mean they cannot twist/turn quickly if the attacker runs past them, Mane would love that.

It does feel like the art of defending is being lost and the pendulum is far too much in the attackers advantage with this FIFA enforced rule.

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#635483 - 28/09/20 10:54 AM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Pickles]
EnergisedReds Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 21718
Originally Posted By Pickles
Attacking players are going to go for the easy option when in the opposing box and flick the ball at defending team players arms. I know I would to gain an easy penalty!

Whilst referees have no room for discretion over this handball rule, expect a lot more penalties awarded this season.


The discretion they have is whether the hand was in it's natural position or not, I think the ref judged it wrongly for Spurs, the rest were well judged from what I can recall


Edited by EnergisedReds (28/09/20 10:54 AM)

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#635489 - 28/09/20 02:10 PM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Stanley Park]
Pickles Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 23/12/15
Posts: 4970
Q&A: What is the handball law? Will the Premier League change their approach? What do our referees think of it? MARK CLATTENBURG answers the questions

What is the handball law?

It is an offence if a player touches the ball with his hand or arm below the sleeve when he has made his body 'unnaturally bigger'. This applies even if the ball ricochets off an opponent and on to their arm, as with the penalty awarded last week against Matt Doherty after it deflected off Spurs team-mate Harry Winks's foot.

In my view, this law does not lend itself to the spirit of the game. No wonder fans are disillusioned.

When was this law introduced?

Though it has only started to plague the Premier League this season, the new law was introduced by IFAB — the game's lawmakers — in the summer of 2019. IFAB added anything above shoulder height was not a 'natural' position, hence Eric Dier's punishment on Sunday.

Rather than rushing these rules in for 2019-20 — the same season VAR was introduced — PGMOL chief Riley decided to delay introducing this law to the Premier League until 2020-21.

Will the Premier League change their approach to handballs?

The good news is they could change their interpretation of the law — namely what they consider to be an 'unnatural' position of a player's arms. The bad news is they are unlikely to do so. This is bound to be discussed at the shareholders meeting in October. But reverting to a more lenient way of looking at handballs would see clubs such as Liverpool and Manchester City playing by one set of rules in the Premier League, and another when competing in UEFA competitions.

On top of that, Premier League chiefs would be concerned about distorting the competition by changing their approach to handballs part-way through a season. Expect many more months of this, I'm afraid.

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#635490 - 28/09/20 04:54 PM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Pickles]
EnergisedReds Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 21718
Originally Posted By Pickles
Q&A: What is the handball law? Will the Premier League change their approach? What do our referees think of it? MARK CLATTENBURG answers the questions

What is the handball law?

It is an offence if a player touches the ball with his hand or arm below the sleeve when he has made his body 'unnaturally bigger'. This applies even if the ball ricochets off an opponent and on to their arm, as with the penalty awarded last week against Matt Doherty after it deflected off Spurs team-mate Harry Winks's foot.

In my view, this law does not lend itself to the spirit of the game. No wonder fans are disillusioned.

When was this law introduced?

Though it has only started to plague the Premier League this season, the new law was introduced by IFAB — the game's lawmakers — in the summer of 2019. IFAB added anything above shoulder height was not a 'natural' position, hence Eric Dier's punishment on Sunday.

Rather than rushing these rules in for 2019-20 — the same season VAR was introduced — PGMOL chief Riley decided to delay introducing this law to the Premier League until 2020-21.

Will the Premier League change their approach to handballs?

The good news is they could change their interpretation of the law — namely what they consider to be an 'unnatural' position of a player's arms. The bad news is they are unlikely to do so. This is bound to be discussed at the shareholders meeting in October. But reverting to a more lenient way of looking at handballs would see clubs such as Liverpool and Manchester City playing by one set of rules in the Premier League, and another when competing in UEFA competitions.

On top of that, Premier League chiefs would be concerned about distorting the competition by changing their approach to handballs part-way through a season. Expect many more months of this, I'm afraid.


Players should start to keep their hands in their natural position, IMO, so far only the Dier one looks very harsh as how do you define natural position if a player is jumping, for the rest I think they got it right.

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#635502 - 30/09/20 07:52 AM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Stanley Park]
ghostgoal Offline
Under 16 Player

Registered: 21/07/18
Posts: 193
Loc: Merseyside
I may be wrong but last year, wasn’t proximity between ball played and the player taken into account, or has that just been removed? It seems with the introduction of VAR they’re doing as much as they can to remove any subjectivity out of the rules which in a lot of ways makes sense as, what is clearly demonstrable over the last few years, is that inconsistency between decisions directly correlated with the interpretation of whichever ref officiated any given game. So, in short. The lack of common sense that our refs have necessitates the need to remove as much possibility to having to apply it to the rules in decision making. Making everything black and white makes it easier and more consistent at the expense of the game we all know and love. Refs incompetence again, ruining it for everyone.

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#635503 - 30/09/20 11:02 AM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: ghostgoal]
EnergisedReds Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 21718
Originally Posted By ghostgoal
I may be wrong but last year, wasn’t proximity between ball played and the player taken into account, or has that just been removed? It seems with the introduction of VAR they’re doing as much as they can to remove any subjectivity out of the rules which in a lot of ways makes sense as, what is clearly demonstrable over the last few years, is that inconsistency between decisions directly correlated with the interpretation of whichever ref officiated any given game. So, in short. The lack of common sense that our refs have necessitates the need to remove as much possibility to having to apply it to the rules in decision making. Making everything black and white makes it easier and more consistent at the expense of the game we all know and love. Refs incompetence again, ruining it for everyone.


I understand that they agreed to bring some subjectivity in the decision making process since the week end

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#635504 - 30/09/20 12:22 PM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: EnergisedReds]
ecnirp98 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 5567
Loc: Madchester
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By ghostgoal
I may be wrong but last year, wasn’t proximity between ball played and the player taken into account, or has that just been removed? It seems with the introduction of VAR they’re doing as much as they can to remove any subjectivity out of the rules which in a lot of ways makes sense as, what is clearly demonstrable over the last few years, is that inconsistency between decisions directly correlated with the interpretation of whichever ref officiated any given game. So, in short. The lack of common sense that our refs have necessitates the need to remove as much possibility to having to apply it to the rules in decision making. Making everything black and white makes it easier and more consistent at the expense of the game we all know and love. Refs incompetence again, ruining it for everyone.


I understand that they agreed to bring some subjectivity in the decision making process since the week end


Yeah, before that they were all following FIFA's guidance, ads FIFA wanted to standardise the rule across all leagues, lets see what subjectivity brings....

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#635507 - 30/09/20 09:35 PM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: Stanley Park]
TheMightyLFC Online   content
Under 23 Player

Registered: 15/12/10
Posts: 4228
Subjectivity will bring bias and inconsistency. Now everyone will be able to have a go at the ref again and we'll be back to square one.
_________________________
'I was only in the game for the love of football - and I wanted to bring back happiness to the people of Liverpool.' Bill Shankly

'We should have made a signing or two in the last couple of transfer windows.' Vish

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#635509 - 30/09/20 11:36 PM Re: VAR & Handball rule second season in - your views ? [Re: TheMightyLFC]
Snakeye Online   happy
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/09
Posts: 10697
Loc: New Zealand
Originally Posted By TheMightyLFC
Subjectivity will bring bias and inconsistency. Now everyone will be able to have a go at the ref again and we'll be back to square one.


This! Exactly, it's back to square one, I'd much rather we have a blanket rule so there is no bias.
_________________________
Back to Back World Champions baby!

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