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#628517 - 23/10/19 04:35 AM First Quarter Report
TheMightyLFC Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 15/12/10
Posts: 4116
It's a strange one. top of the league, 6 points clear with 8 wins out of 9 BUT.... it does include a some stuttering performances (Sunday, Sheffield United, Leicester), the defeat to Napoli and we don't quite have the momentum. I'd give ourselves a mark of 8/10.

I sense that we're in what could turn out to be a critical 6/7 week period. Sunday's game; Spurs at home this weekend; City on 10/11 and Everton on 04/12... with away games at Villa and Palace in between. Will we fall back with the rest of the pack or will we maintain the gap or even extend our lead?

We have a great chance to achieve the ultimate in the league. It could be our last chance with this team as I suspect that, given this team has been together 2-3 years, things may start to change at the end of the season. Can we hold our nerve, keep raking the points in and get some decent points out of the Spurs, City and Everton games?

After last weekend's draw, this weekend is huge for us. City aren't at their best, they haven't built a run yet and something doesn't seem quite right in their camp. What an opportunity we have to keep extending the lead.

But I guess that's just easy talk and it's not going to be that easy at all. Dropping points on Sunday was annoying and now Spurs will probably raise their game against us too. I also fear that our lack of strength in depth will cost us at some point - did it cost us on Sunday already? On the other hand, you just never know... it may all come good and we could be in dreamland before Christmas smile
_________________________
'I was only in the game for the love of football - and I wanted to bring back happiness to the people of Liverpool.' Bill Shankly

'We should have made a signing or two in the last couple of transfer windows.' Vish

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#628520 - 23/10/19 12:08 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
Pickles Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 23/12/15
Posts: 4307
Unfortunately "if" we don't win the PL this season or retain the CL, I can see a break up of the team in some capacity.

VVD will be 29 next July, Salah will be 28 next July, Bobby has just turned 28, Mane will be 28 next April...crucial stages of these players futures approaching 30 wanting to set their legacies with winners medals. It'll be nigh on impossible for Klopp to appease everybody if we go empty handed and buy into what he's been trying to build for what will have been 5 years with 1 CL trophy to show for it.

Hamann is saying we are showing a growing interest in Sancho which could mean we are planning for at least 1 of Salah or Mane leaving next season.

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#628521 - 23/10/19 01:06 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By TheMightyLFC
It's a strange one. top of the league, 6 points clear with 8 wins out of 9 BUT.... it does include a some stuttering performances (Sunday, Sheffield United, Leicester), the defeat to Napoli and we don't quite have the momentum. I'd give ourselves a mark of 8/10.

I sense that we're in what could turn out to be a critical 6/7 week period. Sunday's game; Spurs at home this weekend; City on 10/11 and Everton on 04/12... with away games at Villa and Palace in between. Will we fall back with the rest of the pack or will we maintain the gap or even extend our lead?

We have a great chance to achieve the ultimate in the league. It could be our last chance with this team as I suspect that, given this team has been together 2-3 years, things may start to change at the end of the season. Can we hold our nerve, keep raking the points in and get some decent points out of the Spurs, City and Everton games?

After last weekend's draw, this weekend is huge for us. City aren't at their best, they haven't built a run yet and something doesn't seem quite right in their camp. What an opportunity we have to keep extending the lead.

But I guess that's just easy talk and it's not going to be that easy at all. Dropping points on Sunday was annoying and now Spurs will probably raise their game against us too. I also fear that our lack of strength in depth will cost us at some point - did it cost us on Sunday already? On the other hand, you just never know... it may all come good and we could be in dreamland before Christmas smile


I would say 9.5/10 on results and 7.5/10 on quality of football and of course results is more important. That said, I don't think we can win the league by having the same kind of performance through the season, we need to step up. The big risk for me is the squad quality, especially in attack and VVD cover, we lose one or 2 players we will suffer.

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#628553 - 24/10/19 02:08 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
Hercules/AF 58 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 8520
There's two ways to look at it IMO. Those games where we stuttered over the line can be seen as evidence of a strong ("Monster") mentality, or they can be seen as luck or happenstance. I'd like to think it's the "monster", given how we kept going and fought for those narrow wins.
For me whether or not we can keep that fighting mentality going over the entire season, especially with those additional games this season, will be decided by the depth of our squad, and that's a worry. There was a glimmer of hope with the performances of Ox and Keita last night, and that'll help. However the lack of reliable quality backup for our front three including the likes of VvD, Robertson and TAA is a major hostage to fourtune, and could prove fatal.
However having said that, we went largely injury free (1st eleven) last season, so who knows?
My fairy friends were muttering about bubbles bursting, fatigue and all that shyte, but sure what do they know?

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#628582 - 25/10/19 01:59 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
redordead13 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/08/11
Posts: 8475
Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
People mention quality back up for the front 3, but what teams actually have that?

When Barca had MSN, they didn't have anyone of the same quality to replace those three, but no one cared, because those 3 were so boss. Similarly, when one was out, the others stepped up.

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#628584 - 25/10/19 02:51 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: redordead13]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By redordead13
People mention quality back up for the front 3, but what teams actually have that?

When Barca had MSN, they didn't have anyone of the same quality to replace those three, but no one cared, because those 3 were so boss. Similarly, when one was out, the others stepped up.


City has Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, D.Silva, B.Silva, Mahrez for 3 to 4 positions. Yes, some are much better than others but the gap is not as big as Origi or Brewster and our 3 forwards. They are our main opponents. Even Spurs have got Kane, Son, Eriksen, Lucas, Alli, Lamella as forwards maybe only the latter probably worst than Origi, Barca has Messi, Greizman, Suarez and Dembele and they are in less competitions than us in a softer league.

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#628585 - 25/10/19 04:37 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
You’re forgetting Ox, Shaq and dare I say Lallana for ourselves to add to a Origi and Brewster. Gini has also proved he can be effective further forward, for the national side at least.

The basic fact is that if any team lost one or two of its main front men they’d struggle.

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#628586 - 25/10/19 06:33 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
You’re forgetting Ox, Shaq and dare I say Lallana for ourselves to add to a Origi and Brewster. Gini has also proved he can be effective further forward, for the national side at least.

The basic fact is that if any team lost one or two of its main front men they’d struggle.


We might have the players but none are of the level of City players or our forwards despite Lallana scoring in the last game. Shaq doesn't even get games, maybe Ox but that's really maybe for quite some time. That we really missed a good forward was so obvious at OT. Good thing is that Lallana is so invisible that nobody saw him running to score.


Edited by EnergisedReds (25/10/19 06:33 PM)

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#628587 - 25/10/19 06:59 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
TheMightyLFC Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 15/12/10
Posts: 4116
I don't think it was a forward we missed at OT... it was a creative midfielder. Someone behind the forward line who can either play a pass, go past players, score goals. i.e. give the opposition someone else to worry about if their plan is to neutralise our front three and the deliveries from Robertson and TAA.
_________________________
'I was only in the game for the love of football - and I wanted to bring back happiness to the people of Liverpool.' Bill Shankly

'We should have made a signing or two in the last couple of transfer windows.' Vish

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#628589 - 25/10/19 07:35 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: EnergisedReds]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
You’re forgetting Ox, Shaq and dare I say Lallana for ourselves to add to a Origi and Brewster. Gini has also proved he can be effective further forward, for the national side at least.

The basic fact is that if any team lost one or two of its main front men they’d struggle.


We might have the players but none are of the level of City players or our forwards despite Lallana scoring in the last game. Shaq doesn't even get games, maybe Ox but that's really maybe for quite some time. That we really missed a good forward was so obvious at OT. Good thing is that Lallana is so invisible that nobody saw him running to score.


Yeah and we’re still a way ahead of them. If only we’d bought a player. Any player cry

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#628590 - 25/10/19 07:38 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By TheMightyLFC
I don't think it was a forward we missed at OT... it was a creative midfielder. Someone behind the forward line who can either play a pass, go past players, score goals. i.e. give the opposition someone else to worry about if their plan is to neutralise our front three and the deliveries from Robertson and TAA.


Or put Origi in the centre and play to his strengths rather than use him as if he’s the same type of player as the other three. It’s the one thing that Klopp doesn’t do well for me. Rejigging slightly to get the best out of who’s available is always better than trying to shoehorn players into what they’re not.

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#628591 - 26/10/19 02:48 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
You’re forgetting Ox, Shaq and dare I say Lallana for ourselves to add to a Origi and Brewster. Gini has also proved he can be effective further forward, for the national side at least.

The basic fact is that if any team lost one or two of its main front men they’d struggle.


We might have the players but none are of the level of City players or our forwards despite Lallana scoring in the last game. Shaq doesn't even get games, maybe Ox but that's really maybe for quite some time. That we really missed a good forward was so obvious at OT. Good thing is that Lallana is so invisible that nobody saw him running to score.


Yeah and we’re still a way ahead of them. If only we’d bought a player. Any player cry


Definitely not any player as we have players like Origi, Lallana, Brewster, we just needed to buy better, but, despite the record revenues and probably profits, we had more bills to pay apparently.

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#628592 - 26/10/19 06:45 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
You’re forgetting Ox, Shaq and dare I say Lallana for ourselves to add to a Origi and Brewster. Gini has also proved he can be effective further forward, for the national side at least.

The basic fact is that if any team lost one or two of its main front men they’d struggle.


We might have the players but none are of the level of City players or our forwards despite Lallana scoring in the last game. Shaq doesn't even get games, maybe Ox but that's really maybe for quite some time. That we really missed a good forward was so obvious at OT. Good thing is that Lallana is so invisible that nobody saw him running to score.


Yeah and we’re still a way ahead of them. If only we’d bought a player. Any player cry


We are ahead of them because our forwards have been fit most of the time, coincidence, we lost 2 points when Salah was out and no need to buy any player as we have Origi, Brewster and Lallana as any players, we need better. Yes, we may be lucky to have our forwards fit the whole season, however, for me that's a big risk and short sightedness.

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#628593 - 26/10/19 08:17 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
Our forwards have shown to be pretty robust with only a few injuries between them so not really trusting to luck is it? Well not anymore than anyone else does it you do with any player.

We could’ve bought your man crush Werner and he got injured long term in his first game. The next game Salah could’ve got injured long term. So whatever we do we trust to luck if you want to call it that. You can’t legislate and buy new player because your current ones MIGHT get injured. You’d have hundreds of players.

We have cover that is good enough. I know you don’t agree but Klopp thinks we have and he knows his onions. They’re not as good as those at City(?) but we can’t afford to spank £50m on a bench warmer or the wages that will come with it. Like it or not that’s the reality of it and no amount of moaning and claiming we must have money will change that.

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#628594 - 26/10/19 08:57 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Our forwards have shown to be pretty robust with only a few injuries between them so not really trusting to luck is it? Well not anymore than anyone else does it you do with any player.

We could’ve bought your man crush Werner and he got injured long term in his first game. The next game Salah could’ve got injured long term. So whatever we do we trust to luck if you want to call it that. You can’t legislate and buy new player because your current ones MIGHT get injured. You’d have hundreds of players.

We have cover that is good enough. I know you don’t agree but Klopp thinks we have and he knows his onions. They’re not as good as those at City(?) but we can’t afford to spank £50m on a bench warmer or the wages that will come with it. Like it or not that’s the reality of it and no amount of moaning and claiming we must have money will change that.


I think we could have afford to spend 50m after the record revenues we had last season. Klopp said we had bills to pay, don't understand how our bills suddenly got to record high. The probability of having 2 players injured is less than having 1 injured.


Edited by EnergisedReds (26/10/19 08:58 AM)

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#628597 - 26/10/19 10:48 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
It is strange how he said we had no money because of bills. But he knows what he’s doing. I think he believes that the squad can do what it needs to to win and that the right addition wasn’t available. We all know Klopp won’t buy unless it’s 100% the right player.

Not sure it’s less likely that two players will get injured than one. The reality is there is no way of knowing or predicting. We could go the whole season with no injuries or have a complete mare and have lots of injuries. There’s no way to know or predict what will happen. Just look at Alisson’s injury. No one could predict a keeper would pull a calf.

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#628598 - 26/10/19 11:30 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
It is strange how he said we had no money because of bills. But he knows what he’s doing. I think he believes that the squad can do what it needs to to win and that the right addition wasn’t available. We all know Klopp won’t buy unless it’s 100% the right player.

Not sure it’s less likely that two players will get injured than one. The reality is there is no way of knowing or predicting. We could go the whole season with no injuries or have a complete mare and have lots of injuries. There’s no way to know or predict what will happen. Just look at Alisson’s injury. No one could predict a keeper would pull a calf.


We will have the most number of games this season than ever with the club world cup in Qatar, let's hope injuries is not the reason we miss on the league after such a good start. The way FSG have behaved in the transfer window shows they have no ambition and Klopp saying we have bills to pay proves that to me.

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#628602 - 26/10/19 01:54 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
It’s got nothing to do with FSG. Money is there and if Klopp wanted someone we’d have gone for them. Not sure why everyone thinks different?

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#628605 - 26/10/19 04:07 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
It’s got nothing to do with FSG. Money is there and if Klopp wanted someone we’d have gone for them. Not sure why everyone thinks different?


Maybe because we bought nobody and Klopp said we had bills to pay. In any case waiting for the annual report to see what bills we had to pay, won't be surprised if it is some shareholders loan.

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#628607 - 26/10/19 06:10 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
The Kop Prophet Offline
Under 16 Player

Registered: 21/05/18
Posts: 275
Chelsea didn't buy anyone and they're looking better game by game.

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#628608 - 26/10/19 06:14 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
TheMightyLFC Offline
Under 23 Player

Registered: 15/12/10
Posts: 4116
But they did get Pulisic in Jan... when we got...er… nobody in Jan either I believe whistle
_________________________
'I was only in the game for the love of football - and I wanted to bring back happiness to the people of Liverpool.' Bill Shankly

'We should have made a signing or two in the last couple of transfer windows.' Vish

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#628609 - 26/10/19 07:43 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: EnergisedReds]
ecnirp98 Online   content
Under 23 Player

Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 4863
Loc: Madchester
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
It’s got nothing to do with FSG. Money is there and if Klopp wanted someone we’d have gone for them. Not sure why everyone thinks different?


Maybe because we bought nobody and Klopp said we had bills to pay. In any case waiting for the annual report to see what bills we had to pay, won't be surprised if it is some shareholders loan.


A large chunk of bills we paid was giving new improved long term contracts to the likes of Firmino, Salah & Mane, which meant we kept them rather than losing them to the likes of RM & Barca, which has happened in previous seasons, also means on long contracts they have a larger sell on value in the coming seasons, when I expect we will sell and bring in new replacements.

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#628611 - 27/10/19 03:51 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: ecnirp98]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By ecnirp98
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
It’s got nothing to do with FSG. Money is there and if Klopp wanted someone we’d have gone for them. Not sure why everyone thinks different?


Maybe because we bought nobody and Klopp said we had bills to pay. In any case waiting for the annual report to see what bills we had to pay, won't be surprised if it is some shareholders loan.


A large chunk of bills we paid was giving new improved long term contracts to the likes of Firmino, Salah & Mane, which meant we kept them rather than losing them to the likes of RM & Barca, which has happened in previous seasons, also means on long contracts they have a larger sell on value in the coming seasons, when I expect we will sell and bring in new replacements.


New improved contracts means higher wages for sure but every year and it will not be a big lump sum, can't see this eating up too much of our record revenues. On top of that we had a net gain of 60m last season on players' transactions, so even if you were right, we should have had that money to invest in players. I rather think we paid a big proportion of the shareholders loan taken to build the new stand which if true is wrong, it should have been financed over at least 10 years as capital expenditure.

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#628612 - 27/10/19 03:53 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By TheMightyLFC
But they did get Pulisic in Jan... when we got...er… nobody in Jan either I believe whistle


Exactly and I think they knew in Jan they will have a ban, clever.

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#628617 - 27/10/19 11:38 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: EnergisedReds]
redordead13 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/08/11
Posts: 8475
Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
People mention quality back up for the front 3, but what teams actually have that?

When Barca had MSN, they didn't have anyone of the same quality to replace those three, but no one cared, because those 3 were so boss. Similarly, when one was out, the others stepped up.


City has Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, D.Silva, B.Silva, Mahrez for 3 to 4 positions. Yes, some are much better than others but the gap is not as big as Origi or Brewster and our 3 forwards. They are our main opponents. Even Spurs have got Kane, Son, Eriksen, Lucas, Alli, Lamella as forwards maybe only the latter probably worst than Origi, Barca has Messi, Greizman, Suarez and Dembele and they are in less competitions than us in a softer league.


First, Sane is out for the season, so he doesn't count. D Silva is fading, and he and B Silva are midfielders, not forwards. So is De Bruyne. They have Sterling, Aguero, Jesus, and Mahrez for their front 3. We have Firmino, Salah, Mane, Shaquiri, Origi. City's replacements are slightly better, but theirs have to play more because of injuries. Our starters are less injury prone than the likes of Aguero, Sane. In the Midfield, De Bruyne has been injury prone too..

Erikson and Ali are not part of a front 3 either. Midfielders. Spurs have Lucas, Son, Kane, and Lamela. And they're a moot point, as far back as they are.

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#628619 - 27/10/19 12:26 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: redordead13]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By redordead13
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
People mention quality back up for the front 3, but what teams actually have that?

When Barca had MSN, they didn't have anyone of the same quality to replace those three, but no one cared, because those 3 were so boss. Similarly, when one was out, the others stepped up.


City has Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, D.Silva, B.Silva, Mahrez for 3 to 4 positions. Yes, some are much better than others but the gap is not as big as Origi or Brewster and our 3 forwards. They are our main opponents. Even Spurs have got Kane, Son, Eriksen, Lucas, Alli, Lamella as forwards maybe only the latter probably worst than Origi, Barca has Messi, Greizman, Suarez and Dembele and they are in less competitions than us in a softer league.


First, Sane is out for the season, so he doesn't count. D Silva is fading, and he and B Silva are midfielders, not forwards. So is De Bruyne. They have Sterling, Aguero, Jesus, and Mahrez for their front 3. We have Firmino, Salah, Mane, Shaquiri, Origi. City's replacements are slightly better, but theirs have to play more because of injuries. Our starters are less injury prone than the likes of Aguero, Sane. In the Midfield, De Bruyne has been injury prone too..

Erikson and Ali are not part of a front 3 either. Midfielders. Spurs have Lucas, Son, Kane, and Lamela. And they're a moot point, as far back as they are.


I am talking about the squad City has not who is available or not. Yes they have been quite unlucky with injuries or we have been lucky, but can you imagine what will happen if our players get injured like them, they are only 3 points (or six) behind us after losing Sane, Laporte, De Bruyne for long periods this season. Both Silva's are attacking midfielders and can play on the wings, in fact Bernardo has played on the right wing a number of times. David Silva us fading? Probably but he could easily fit in our team and he is one of their best players this season. The whole point I am making is that we don't have a squad to play the number of games we have to play and losing any of our 3 forwards long term will be a huge problem, we had a glance against United when Salah was injured. Do you really think we can go all the way if one of our forwards hat injured long term?

You have a point regarding Spurs, but they are not our main opponents for the title


Edited by EnergisedReds (27/10/19 12:28 PM)

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#628658 - 28/10/19 01:59 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: EnergisedReds]
redordead13 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/08/11
Posts: 8475
Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
People mention quality back up for the front 3, but what teams actually have that?

When Barca had MSN, they didn't have anyone of the same quality to replace those three, but no one cared, because those 3 were so boss. Similarly, when one was out, the others stepped up.


City has Aguero, Jesus, Sterling, Sane, D.Silva, B.Silva, Mahrez for 3 to 4 positions. Yes, some are much better than others but the gap is not as big as Origi or Brewster and our 3 forwards. They are our main opponents. Even Spurs have got Kane, Son, Eriksen, Lucas, Alli, Lamella as forwards maybe only the latter probably worst than Origi, Barca has Messi, Greizman, Suarez and Dembele and they are in less competitions than us in a softer league.


First, Sane is out for the season, so he doesn't count. D Silva is fading, and he and B Silva are midfielders, not forwards. So is De Bruyne. They have Sterling, Aguero, Jesus, and Mahrez for their front 3. We have Firmino, Salah, Mane, Shaquiri, Origi. City's replacements are slightly better, but theirs have to play more because of injuries. Our starters are less injury prone than the likes of Aguero, Sane. In the Midfield, De Bruyne has been injury prone too..

Erikson and Ali are not part of a front 3 either. Midfielders. Spurs have Lucas, Son, Kane, and Lamela. And they're a moot point, as far back as they are.


I am talking about the squad City has not who is available or not. Yes they have been quite unlucky with injuries or we have been lucky, but can you imagine what will happen if our players get injured like them, they are only 3 points (or six) behind us after losing Sane, Laporte, De Bruyne for long periods this season. Both Silva's are attacking midfielders and can play on the wings, in fact Bernardo has played on the right wing a number of times. David Silva us fading? Probably but he could easily fit in our team and he is one of their best players this season. The whole point I am making is that we don't have a squad to play the number of games we have to play and losing any of our 3 forwards long term will be a huge problem, we had a glance against United when Salah was injured. Do you really think we can go all the way if one of our forwards hat injured long term?

You have a point regarding Spurs, but they are not our main opponents for the title


David Silva is class, but he couldn't play in this system. Not enough legs. Bernardo CAN play there the same way Ox or Gini can, but you omitted them. It's not really his position. If Aguero or Sterling got injured, they would have a significant wobble, as evidenced by December last year. Jesus has contributed, but so has Origi. They are a bit deeper up top than we are (though not that much), but we are much deeper defensively.

For example, our 4th choice CB is better than whoever would start next to Laporte (if he were fit).

VVD>Matip>Laporte>Gomez>Lovren>Oatamendi>Stones.

The difference is they have had significant injury issues at the back and lack of cover for awhile, and it got worse letting Kompany and Mangala go without replacements. Their best left back and their best Centerback are injury prone, and none of our front 3 have a record that suggests that they will spend much time on the table. A lot of that is down to recruitment. Even City can't be deep everywhere, and the places where you aren't, you have to have players you can count on to be fit.

They have more creativity than we do in their midfield, but our system is different than theirs, relying on the full backs for ammunition. We can rotate our midfield a lot without a significant drop in quality. Their best midfielder is also injury prone. Henderson and Ox have had injury problems in the past, but if we had to go with Milner and Keita instead, I don't see that big of a drop off.

I'm not that worried about the front three. Neither of them had any injury issues really before joining, and apart from one freak accident Mane had in his first season, none of them have had long spells out. We saw what we could do without Salah and Firmino against Barca, and look what happened. United is a weird game, and we always seem to struggle at OT.

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#628662 - 28/10/19 04:05 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: redordead13]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By redordead13

David Silva is class, but he couldn't play in this system. Not enough legs. Bernardo CAN play there the same way Ox or Gini can, but you omitted them. It's not really his position. If Aguero or Sterling got injured, they would have a significant wobble, as evidenced by December last year. Jesus has contributed, but so has Origi. They are a bit deeper up top than we are (though not that much), but we are much deeper defensively.

For example, our 4th choice CB is better than whoever would start next to Laporte (if he were fit).

VVD>Matip>Laporte>Gomez>Lovren>Oatamendi>Stones.

The difference is they have had significant injury issues at the back and lack of cover for awhile, and it got worse letting Kompany and Mangala go without replacements. Their best left back and their best Centerback are injury prone, and none of our front 3 have a record that suggests that they will spend much time on the table. A lot of that is down to recruitment. Even City can't be deep everywhere, and the places where you aren't, you have to have players you can count on to be fit.

They have more creativity than we do in their midfield, but our system is different than theirs, relying on the full backs for ammunition. We can rotate our midfield a lot without a significant drop in quality. Their best midfielder is also injury prone. Henderson and Ox have had injury problems in the past, but if we had to go with Milner and Keita instead, I don't see that big of a drop off.

I'm not that worried about the front three. Neither of them had any injury issues really before joining, and apart from one freak accident Mane had in his first season, none of them have had long spells out. We saw what we could do without Salah and Firmino against Barca, and look what happened. United is a weird game, and we always seem to struggle at OT.


Bernardo Silva has played a number of times on the right wing and Jesus is playing regularly ahead of Aguero, David Silva can play on the wing as well and is still much better than Ox, Gini plays more as a defensive midfielder. It's true that they have had more injuries and not buying Maguire will cost them. Relying on our front 3 not getting injured is a huge risk IMO.

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#628694 - 28/10/19 08:30 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: EnergisedReds]
ecnirp98 Online   content
Under 23 Player

Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 4863
Loc: Madchester
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13

David Silva is class, but he couldn't play in this system. Not enough legs. Bernardo CAN play there the same way Ox or Gini can, but you omitted them. It's not really his position. If Aguero or Sterling got injured, they would have a significant wobble, as evidenced by December last year. Jesus has contributed, but so has Origi. They are a bit deeper up top than we are (though not that much), but we are much deeper defensively.

For example, our 4th choice CB is better than whoever would start next to Laporte (if he were fit).

VVD>Matip>Laporte>Gomez>Lovren>Oatamendi>Stones.

The difference is they have had significant injury issues at the back and lack of cover for awhile, and it got worse letting Kompany and Mangala go without replacements. Their best left back and their best Centerback are injury prone, and none of our front 3 have a record that suggests that they will spend much time on the table. A lot of that is down to recruitment. Even City can't be deep everywhere, and the places where you aren't, you have to have players you can count on to be fit.

They have more creativity than we do in their midfield, but our system is different than theirs, relying on the full backs for ammunition. We can rotate our midfield a lot without a significant drop in quality. Their best midfielder is also injury prone. Henderson and Ox have had injury problems in the past, but if we had to go with Milner and Keita instead, I don't see that big of a drop off.

I'm not that worried about the front three. Neither of them had any injury issues really before joining, and apart from one freak accident Mane had in his first season, none of them have had long spells out. We saw what we could do without Salah and Firmino against Barca, and look what happened. United is a weird game, and we always seem to struggle at OT.


Bernardo Silva has played a number of times on the right wing and Jesus is playing regularly ahead of Aguero, David Silva can play on the wing as well and is still much better than Ox, Gini plays more as a defensive midfielder. It's true that they have had more injuries and not buying Maguire will cost them. Relying on our front 3 not getting injured is a huge risk IMO.


I agree it's a risk, but I do not see who we could have brought in as top quality cover who would happily sit on the bench behind the front 3, I would have liked us to sign someone, but Klopp didn't, we all know how stubborn he is, he must be happy with Origi & Brewster as cover, time will tell I guess, lets see how they do on Wednesday, Elliott could be the surprise player to come off the bench.

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#628701 - 29/10/19 02:37 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: ecnirp98]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By ecnirp98
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By redordead13

David Silva is class, but he couldn't play in this system. Not enough legs. Bernardo CAN play there the same way Ox or Gini can, but you omitted them. It's not really his position. If Aguero or Sterling got injured, they would have a significant wobble, as evidenced by December last year. Jesus has contributed, but so has Origi. They are a bit deeper up top than we are (though not that much), but we are much deeper defensively.

For example, our 4th choice CB is better than whoever would start next to Laporte (if he were fit).

VVD>Matip>Laporte>Gomez>Lovren>Oatamendi>Stones.

The difference is they have had significant injury issues at the back and lack of cover for awhile, and it got worse letting Kompany and Mangala go without replacements. Their best left back and their best Centerback are injury prone, and none of our front 3 have a record that suggests that they will spend much time on the table. A lot of that is down to recruitment. Even City can't be deep everywhere, and the places where you aren't, you have to have players you can count on to be fit.

They have more creativity than we do in their midfield, but our system is different than theirs, relying on the full backs for ammunition. We can rotate our midfield a lot without a significant drop in quality. Their best midfielder is also injury prone. Henderson and Ox have had injury problems in the past, but if we had to go with Milner and Keita instead, I don't see that big of a drop off.

I'm not that worried about the front three. Neither of them had any injury issues really before joining, and apart from one freak accident Mane had in his first season, none of them have had long spells out. We saw what we could do without Salah and Firmino against Barca, and look what happened. United is a weird game, and we always seem to struggle at OT.


Bernardo Silva has played a number of times on the right wing and Jesus is playing regularly ahead of Aguero, David Silva can play on the wing as well and is still much better than Ox, Gini plays more as a defensive midfielder. It's true that they have had more injuries and not buying Maguire will cost them. Relying on our front 3 not getting injured is a huge risk IMO.


I agree it's a risk, but I do not see who we could have brought in as top quality cover who would happily sit on the bench behind the front 3, I would have liked us to sign someone, but Klopp didn't, we all know how stubborn he is, he must be happy with Origi & Brewster as cover, time will tell I guess, lets see how they do on Wednesday, Elliott could be the surprise player to come off the bench.


There is a full army of scouts working at LFC so will be very surprised they couldn't find better than Origi, in any case Origi is a different player so not even a replacement for any of the 3 forwards if ever they are unfit, he is more a plan B if anything. United made a great business by buying the young James at 15m, that kind of purchase would have been a great addition if we didn't have the means to buy a proven player. But yes, too late now, let's hope our forwards don't get injured in the next couple of months and we sort this out in Jan, I might be hoping there.

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#628704 - 29/10/19 06:09 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
van Gogh Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 9400
Loc: Out Of Town
And again: It's not about getting someone in and warm the bench. It's about rotation.

Why does that work so well for our midfield, but couldn't work up top?

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#628705 - 29/10/19 07:22 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: van Gogh]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By van Gogh
And again: It's not about getting someone in and warm the bench. It's about rotation.

Why does that work so well for our midfield, but couldn't work up top?


Totally agree

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#628709 - 29/10/19 08:31 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: van Gogh]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By van Gogh
And again: It's not about getting someone in and warm the bench. It's about rotation.

Why does that work so well for our midfield, but couldn't work up top?


Regardless of rotation or warming the bench, we couldn’t have bought anyone close to as good as the front three with just the promise of rotation. Top players want to play and play regularly not be rotated. Better cover than Origi and Brewster could’ve been bought but we’d still be looking at lower quality than the front three. Klopp must think what he’s got is good enough.

For me it’s easier to rotate in midfield. The partnerships are easier to rotate than those up top. Forwards need time together to know each other’s game to get the best out of each other. Most teams stick with their best partnerships and don’t rotate on a regular basis. Same with CB’s. I remember us all complaining when Rafa barely played the same team from one week to the next and our results reflected that.

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#628711 - 29/10/19 10:48 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By van Gogh
And again: It's not about getting someone in and warm the bench. It's about rotation.

Why does that work so well for our midfield, but couldn't work up top?


Regardless of rotation or warming the bench, we couldn’t have bought anyone close to as good as the front three with just the promise of rotation. Top players want to play and play regularly not be rotated. Better cover than Origi and Brewster could’ve been bought but we’d still be looking at lower quality than the front three. Klopp must think what he’s got is good enough.

For me it’s easier to rotate in midfield. The partnerships are easier to rotate than those up top. Forwards need time together to know each other’s game to get the best out of each other. Most teams stick with their best partnerships and don’t rotate on a regular basis. Same with CB’s. I remember us all complaining when Rafa barely played the same team from one week to the next and our results reflected that.


So? City bought Gabriel Jesus for 27m and he provided good cover/rotation for Aguero considered to be one of the best strikers in the league, Bernardo Silva was bought for 40m to provide cover/rotate with Sane and Sterling. Aguero has been injured on and off and Sane long term, good that they bought those players who are both better than Origi and Brewster, though probably not at the same level as Aguero and Sane/Sterling

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#628714 - 29/10/19 11:47 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
wilkij1975 Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21898
Loc: Northamptonshire
So what? You’re talking rotation. That would require a player of equal quality for us not to drop off as we’d have that player playing probably 20 odd games in a rotation with the other three. City don’t do that and Aguero plays the lions share of games when fit so their performances don’t drop off. Not sure why you mention Bernardo Silva as he’s a midfielder?

As I said, we could have got better than Origi and Brewster but only as cover and our front three would still play most games. Origi has chipped in when called upon but so I’d ok as cover but I’d not really want him for a long stint in the team. Going by our forward threes injury record we’d be unlucky for that to happen.

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#628721 - 29/10/19 02:30 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: wilkij1975]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
So what? You’re talking rotation. That would require a player of equal quality for us not to drop off as we’d have that player playing probably 20 odd games in a rotation with the other three. City don’t do that and Aguero plays the lions share of games when fit so their performances don’t drop off. Not sure why you mention Bernardo Silva as he’s a midfielder?

As I said, we could have got better than Origi and Brewster but only as cover and our front three would still play most games. Origi has chipped in when called upon but so I’d ok as cover but I’d not really want him for a long stint in the team. Going by our forward threes injury record we’d be unlucky for that to happen.


Actually Jesus is getting more and more games even when Aguero is available, they even rotate in the same game. Aguero played 9 games starting 6 while Jesus 7 starting 4 in the league. So it's quite balanced

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#628739 - 30/10/19 04:32 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
van Gogh Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 9400
Loc: Out Of Town
A 4:th man of similar quality as the other 3 up top wouldn't be a disaster for any of them, when we talk about the number of games they'd all get over a season.

At least 30 games each, and also some cameos off the bench for the one not getting to start a game.


Edited by van Gogh (30/10/19 04:32 PM)

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#628745 - 30/10/19 07:22 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
redordead13 Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 03/08/11
Posts: 8475
Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
According to Ian McGarry, official negotiations with RB Leipzig have been opened by Liverpool on Timo Werner, per the Echo today.

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#628750 - 30/10/19 08:59 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
van Gogh Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 9400
Loc: Out Of Town
That would be about the right level of player to rotate with the other 3 up top!

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#628757 - 30/10/19 10:53 PM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: van Gogh]
ecnirp98 Online   content
Under 23 Player

Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 4863
Loc: Madchester
Originally Posted By van Gogh
That would be about the right level of player to rotate with the other 3 up top!


Yeah, we have been heavily linked with him for a few years, but then again we had the same with Pulisic, seems we can get Werner allot cheaper if he has the £30 million release clause.

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#628759 - 31/10/19 01:05 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: TheMightyLFC]
*** Suso *** Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 12393
Loc: In bed
yes please make this happen

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#628761 - 31/10/19 11:05 AM Re: First Quarter Report [Re: redordead13]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20688
Originally Posted By redordead13
According to Ian McGarry, official negotiations with RB Leipzig have been opened by Liverpool on Timo Werner, per the Echo today.


At last some sense if true, better late than never and at least our 3 forwards haven't missed significant number of games yet.

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