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#627347 - 12/09/19 07:10 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26344
Loc: Not the EU
I said the IRA and their sympathisers are as thick as planks. Not quite true the ones at the top of the organisation were very clever and cunning. They did not put themselves in harms way, when defeated were sure to organise an amnesty for themselves, and when active kept one step ahead of the security services.

Not so their foot soldiers

However the real daft people are those in the community who tacitally support them. Everytime someone calls British soldiers terrorists or harps on about events 400 years ago gives the IRA a purpose and justification. Sure it's the IRA who planted the bombs and killed and tortured people but those who gave them a sea to swim in have blood on their hands as well
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627349 - 12/09/19 07:41 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I said the IRA and their sympathisers are as thick as planks. Not quite true the ones at the top of the organisation were very clever and cunning. They did not put themselves in harms way, when defeated were sure to organise an amnesty for themselves, and when active kept one step ahead of the security services.

Not so their foot soldiers

However the real daft people are those in the community who tacitally support them. Everytime someone calls British soldiers terrorists or harps on about events 400 years ago gives the IRA a purpose and justification. Sure it's the IRA who planted the bombs and killed and tortured people but those who gave them a sea to swim in have blood on their hands as well


Oh dear, someone is a very angry brexiteer these days.

Let me guess. The IRA stopped Britain getting a good deal from the EU.

So are you still happy to go with no deal. The no deal you told us didn't exist.

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#627352 - 12/09/19 07:57 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26344
Loc: Not the EU
I would prefer a deal however if parliament won't allow that and continue to obstruct it then we have to leave with no deal. That may give short term problems for a few months but we will medium to long term be far better off.

I think the EU know that they don't want a North Sea Singapore devouring their trade so I will stick my neck out here and predict in the next few weeks a new deal will be struck with the EU.

I have no evidence at all for this just call it instinct

That will mean parliament will put itself in a very strange position if again they reject that as in effect they are rejecting brexit in any form. If they do reject it Johnson would have a legal basis to leave with no deal possibility. It's immensely complicated but the recent Parliament law could be invalid by an irony by the supremacy of EU law.

However I don't think Parliament will reject it this time.


Edited by Stanley Park (12/09/19 07:58 PM)
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627359 - 12/09/19 08:25 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I would prefer a deal however if parliament won't allow that and continue to obstruct it then we have to leave with no deal. That may give short term problems for a few months but we will medium to long term be far better off.

I think the EU know that they don't want a North Sea Singapore devouring their trade so I will stick my neck out here and predict in the next few weeks a new deal will be struck with the EU.

I have no evidence at all for this just call it instinct

That will mean parliament will put itself in a very strange position if again they reject that as in effect they are rejecting brexit in any form. If they do reject it Johnson would have a legal basis to leave with no deal possibility. It's immensely complicated but the recent Parliament law could be invalid by an irony by the supremacy of EU law.

However I don't think Parliament will reject it this time.


It will be May's deal printed in a different font.

The backstop will be given a different name to save face for Bojo.

Well it would be that if The Real PM Dominic Cummings wasn't determined to leave with no deal. That's the no deal you are willing to accept but which you have told us doesn't exist.

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#627360 - 12/09/19 08:36 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26344
Loc: Not the EU
The government are playing a game of chess against a parliament that is trying to overturn the 2016 public vote by increasingly bizarre and desperate measures

I agree with you it will be an amended Theresa May deal

That's fine by me and I am sure fine by the nation remainers and leavers the only people who oppose it are 300 or so remain politicians who think democracy only applies when it aligns with their opinion
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627362 - 13/09/19 05:25 AM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20457
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The government are playing a game of chess against a parliament that is trying to overturn the 2016 public vote by increasingly bizarre and desperate measures

I agree with you it will be an amended Theresa May deal

That's fine by me and I am sure fine by the nation remainers and leavers the only people who oppose it are 300 or so remain politicians who think democracy only applies when it aligns with their opinion


So in your opinion preventing a no deal scenario is bizarre and desperate? Do you really think that the likes Ken Clarke and Philip Hammond will be significantly impacted compared to the leave voters in the north for example? Seriously, do you really think they did that for their own interest when they knew they probably would struggle to be candidates of their party, let alone get elected? I think your desperate wish to leave no matter what, is limiting your view.

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#627364 - 13/09/19 11:51 AM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26344
Loc: Not the EU
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The government are playing a game of chess against a parliament that is trying to overturn the 2016 public vote by increasingly bizarre and desperate measures

I agree with you it will be an amended Theresa May deal

That's fine by me and I am sure fine by the nation remainers and leavers the only people who oppose it are 300 or so remain politicians who think democracy only applies when it aligns with their opinion


So in your opinion preventing a no deal scenario is bizarre and desperate? Do you really think that the likes Ken Clarke and Philip Hammond will be significantly impacted compared to the leave voters in the north for example? Seriously, do you really think they did that for their own interest when they knew they probably would struggle to be candidates of their party, let alone get elected? I think your desperate wish to leave no matter what, is limiting your view.


They are not trying to prevent no deal they are trying to overturn brexit and they have been since we voted to leave. They are actively hamstringing both May and now Johnson in attaining a deal. If Johnson gets a deal it will be despite grieve Hammond and Clarke. They are an utter disgrace to their position and it's fitting they have been thrown out of the Tory party for their disloyalty. People like them (I won't call them Tories) are actively promoting a Corbyn government. Come the next election they will stand as independents and will be history. They won't be missed
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627365 - 13/09/19 12:09 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The government are playing a game of chess against a parliament that is trying to overturn the 2016 public vote by increasingly bizarre and desperate measures

I agree with you it will be an amended Theresa May deal

That's fine by me and I am sure fine by the nation remainers and leavers the only people who oppose it are 300 or so remain politicians who think democracy only applies when it aligns with their opinion


So in your opinion preventing a no deal scenario is bizarre and desperate? Do you really think that the likes Ken Clarke and Philip Hammond will be significantly impacted compared to the leave voters in the north for example? Seriously, do you really think they did that for their own interest when they knew they probably would struggle to be candidates of their party, let alone get elected? I think your desperate wish to leave no matter what, is limiting your view.


They are not trying to prevent no deal they are trying to overturn brexit and they have been since we voted to leave. They are actively hamstringing both May and now Johnson in attaining a deal. If Johnson gets a deal it will be despite grieve Hammond and Clarke. They are an utter disgrace to their position and it's fitting they have been thrown out of the Tory party for their disloyalty. People like them (I won't call them Tories) are actively promoting a Corbyn government. Come the next election they will stand as independents and will be history. They won't be missed


So why weren't Bojo, the ERG and all those other tories who prevented Brexit by voting against May's deal not thrown out of the tory party for their disloyaloty.

The hypocrisy is breathtaking as usual.

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#627366 - 13/09/19 01:08 PM Re: Brexit 2016-2019 RIP [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20457
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The government are playing a game of chess against a parliament that is trying to overturn the 2016 public vote by increasingly bizarre and desperate measures

I agree with you it will be an amended Theresa May deal

That's fine by me and I am sure fine by the nation remainers and leavers the only people who oppose it are 300 or so remain politicians who think democracy only applies when it aligns with their opinion


So in your opinion preventing a no deal scenario is bizarre and desperate? Do you really think that the likes Ken Clarke and Philip Hammond will be significantly impacted compared to the leave voters in the north for example? Seriously, do you really think they did that for their own interest when they knew they probably would struggle to be candidates of their party, let alone get elected? I think your desperate wish to leave no matter what, is limiting your view.


They are not trying to prevent no deal they are trying to overturn brexit and they have been since we voted to leave. They are actively hamstringing both May and now Johnson in attaining a deal. If Johnson gets a deal it will be despite grieve Hammond and Clarke. They are an utter disgrace to their position and it's fitting they have been thrown out of the Tory party for their disloyalty. People like them (I won't call them Tories) are actively promoting a Corbyn government. Come the next election they will stand as independents and will be history. They won't be missed


I think you are talking crap about Clarke, Hammond and Grieve, though they voted remain, they all voted May's deal, isn't it?

I don't know UK politics as you but I would say the current Tory is closer to the Farage party than what Tory used to be, after that the moderates left or were kicked out. It would be interesting to see how moderate Tories vote now. I feel a lot of those moderate Tory as the moderate Labour MPs might join the Lib Dems, then you'll have a far right Tory, far left Labour and a moderate Lib Dem. At least the choices would be clear, no?


Edited by EnergisedReds (13/09/19 01:11 PM)

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