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#627180 - 07/09/19 12:17 PM British democracy dead and buried
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Leave to one side MP,s not respecting the publics vote in 2016 it's very clear they have been trying to overturn it since the day after the vote. They have been using increasingly desperate measures. But we all can see that.

However some of the mundane procedural processes they have been using have gone under the radar with the public but are probably more serious than refusing to allow the brexit vote

Take the speaker the speaker is supposed to be an impartial refereee and plays a critical role in our democracy. However the speaker has worked with Remain MP,s and has changed the rules around the order papers, rules that have been in place since 1830. It might sound dull but what this means is the government no longer controls the business of the house in effect the government is no longer has power

This goes way beyond brexit this fundamentally changes our democracy for generations ahead

Then we have remain MP,s refusing to allow elections because they perceive the public will vote for something they don't want. This would not be out of place in a third world dictatorship

Let's suppose now they succeed in not letting Britain leave the EU that would not be the choice of the British people the country will become ungovernable and I feel dramatic social and economic disasters are ahead far far worse than the worst brexit scenario
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627181 - 07/09/19 12:40 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Leave to one side MP,s not respecting the publics vote in 2016 it's very clear they have been trying to overturn it since the day after the vote. They have been using increasingly desperate measures. But we all can see that.

However some of the mundane procedural processes they have been using have gone under the radar with the public but are probably more serious than refusing to allow the brexit vote

Take the speaker the speaker is supposed to be an impartial refereee and plays a critical role in our democracy. However the speaker has worked with Remain MP,s and has changed the rules around the order papers, rules that have been in place since 1830. It might sound dull but what this means is the government no longer controls the business of the house in effect the government is no longer has power

This goes way beyond brexit this fundamentally changes our democracy for generations ahead

Then we have remain MP,s refusing to allow elections because they perceive the public will vote for something they don't want. This would not be out of place in a third world dictatorship

Let's suppose now they succeed in not letting Britain leave the EU that would not be the choice of the British people the country will become ungovernable and I feel dramatic social and economic disasters are ahead far far worse than the worst brexit scenario



I think you are exaggerating out of your wish to leave after your ecstasy of 'winning' unexpectedly. Your democracy is a parliament democracy so whatever is happening is because you have a minority government. The bigger problem is that your whole society is divided, not only your parliament but even families. If you think just leaving will solve everything, I would say you are fooling yourself.

Though I think a new referendum on clear options would be the most sensible way forward, I understand it might divide your society deeper, with leavers feeling they were cheated.

As I said before, maybe a no deal might solve the divide as people see for real the consequences. If people are unhappy, they can have another referendum in 4-5 years.


Edited by EnergisedReds (07/09/19 12:42 PM)

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#627182 - 07/09/19 12:52 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EnergisedReds]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
We are a parliamentary democracy and MP,s use their judgement. However that does not apply in a referendum where parliamentary democracy authorises the delegation of the decision to the people.

I agree we should leave with no deal and if it's as bad as remainers claim then we can rejoin

Anything else other than leaving the EU wont be accepted by leavers and the many remainers who don't agree with leaving the EU but respect democracy that's a lot of hacked off people
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627183 - 07/09/19 01:00 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
We are a parliamentary democracy and MP,s use their judgement. However that does not apply in a referendum where parliamentary democracy authorises the delegation of the decision to the people.

I agree we should leave with no deal and if it's as bad as remainers claim then we can rejoin

Anything else other than leaving the EU wont be accepted by leavers and the many remainers who don't agree with leaving the EU but respect democracy that's a lot of hacked off people


That's not exact if you go by your democracy, I am sure you know that the referendum in real terms was only advisory and not binding, but then I fully understand that leavers are not interested with that fact. I know, it's like winning a final but being denied of the cup. Too much emotions on this I would say.

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#627184 - 07/09/19 01:26 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EnergisedReds]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
The opposition parties are refusing to hold an election until after 31st October because your current PM is a proven liar.

It has always been difficult to run parliament when you are a minority government

It really is as simple as that.

It is easy to talk about leaving with a No Deal when you have your triple lock pension and your family raised. Parliament is simply trying to prevent Bojo from carrying out a catastrophic act of economic self harm. The purge of moderate tories shows you how radical they have become under Bojo

No one voted to leave with No Deal and there are numerous quotes from the leave leaders during the campaign to support that.

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#627185 - 07/09/19 02:03 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
lumba Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 19/03/09
Posts: 22946
Loc: Destination unknown
Well put Shags,wasting your time though.
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#627186 - 07/09/19 02:05 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EnergisedReds]
lumba Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 19/03/09
Posts: 22946
Loc: Destination unknown
Originally Posted By EnergisedReds
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
We are a parliamentary democracy and MP,s use their judgement. However that does not apply in a referendum where parliamentary democracy authorises the delegation of the decision to the people.

I agree we should leave with no deal and if it's as bad as remainers claim then we can rejoin

Anything else other than leaving the EU wont be accepted by leavers and the many remainers who don't agree with leaving the EU but respect democracy that's a lot of hacked off people


That's not exact if you go by your democracy, I am sure you know that the referendum in real terms was only advisory and not binding, but then I fully understand that leavers are not interested with that fact. I know, it's like winning a final but being denied of the cup. Too much emotions on this I would say.
Brexit VAR.
_________________________
That job interview was going so well until I realized I was fukked up on acid in the middle of a cornfield naked and talking to a scarecrow.

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#627188 - 07/09/19 04:13 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
The opposition parties are refusing to hold an election until after 31st October because your current PM is a proven liar.

It has always been difficult to run parliament when you are a minority government

It really is as simple as that.

It is easy to talk about leaving with a No Deal when you have your triple lock pension and your family raised. Parliament is simply trying to prevent Bojo from carrying out a catastrophic act of economic self harm. The purge of moderate tories shows you how radical they have become under Bojo

No one voted to leave with No Deal and there are numerous quotes from the leave leaders during the campaign to support that.




The default legal position to leave is without s deal so knowingly or not, people voted to leave without a deal.

Iím also pretty sure that they could pass law to set an imo able election date. They seem to be able to do whatever else they like. But I think they are scared of losing which I think they will. The Greens are already talking about colluding with the other parties to stop the conservatives.


Edited by wilkij1975 (07/09/19 04:15 PM)

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#627189 - 07/09/19 04:20 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
The opposition parties are refusing to hold an election until after 31st October because your current PM is a proven liar.

It has always been difficult to run parliament when you are a minority government

It really is as simple as that.

It is easy to talk about leaving with a No Deal when you have your triple lock pension and your family raised. Parliament is simply trying to prevent Bojo from carrying out a catastrophic act of economic self harm. The purge of moderate tories shows you how radical they have become under Bojo

No one voted to leave with No Deal and there are numerous quotes from the leave leaders during the campaign to support that.




The default legal position to leave is without s deal so knowingly or not, people voted to leave without a deal.

Iím also pretty sure that they could pass law to set an imo able election date. They seem to be able to do whatever else they like. But I think they are scared of losing which I think they will. The Greens are already talking about colluding with the other parties to stop the conservatives.

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#627190 - 07/09/19 04:23 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP

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#627192 - 07/09/19 04:49 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


I think people did know what they were voting for. However I am quite prepared to believe you didn't know
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627193 - 07/09/19 04:50 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EMP Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 05/04/12
Posts: 9149
Loc: Eire
make it a legally binding vote and go again

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#627194 - 07/09/19 04:52 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
The main reason they are holding off the election till 31st oct other than stopping brexit is it will boost the brexit party. The brexit party will mainly take votes off conservatives so labour think this gives them a better chance plus the great goal of stopping brexit

Our politicians act for themselves and the country can go to hell.
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627195 - 07/09/19 04:54 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


To be fair they knew if they belived the remainers, this is what Cameron said. However, I think those who voted leave believed the Brexit MPs like Gove and Bojo who said that there will be a deal with the EU because the latter needed it more than UK. But of course that was the nth lie.

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#627196 - 07/09/19 04:57 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The main reason they are holding off the election till 31st oct other than stopping brexit is it will boost the brexit party. The brexit party will mainly take votes off conservatives so labour think this gives them a better chance plus the great goal of stopping brexit

Our politicians act for themselves and the country can go to hell.


Why would a couple of weeks election difference favour the Brexit party more, are you going to vote the Farage party if elections are held in November?

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#627197 - 07/09/19 04:59 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


I think people did know what they were voting for. However I am quite prepared to believe you didn't know


Well apparently you know better than these two.

Bojo: There is no plan for a no deal because we are going to get a great deal

Gove: We didn't vote to leave without a deal.

You unfortunately are in full blown unicorn mode, but thankfully these two gentlemen totally contradict you.

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#627198 - 07/09/19 05:26 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627199 - 07/09/19 05:31 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth


What do you mean then, who has stopped Brexit, if anything they have stopped no deal Brexit which was nobody seems to want except Farage and maybe the ERG? Not sure I can follow you there

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#627200 - 07/09/19 05:43 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth


Democracy is a real bitch when it doesn't go your way.

Also I understand your anger. I would be annoyed if I discovered I was sold a lie.

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#627201 - 07/09/19 05:47 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
A free unicorn for whoever guesses the author of the following quote

The EU is better placed to strike trade deals with the US or China, than the UK on its own. More generally, there is a risk that leaving will be globally interpreted as a narrow xenophobic backward looking thing to do.

Answers on a postcard to:

The Powerless PM, 10 Downing Street

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#627202 - 07/09/19 08:04 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth


Democracy is a real bitch when it doesn't go your way.

Also I understand your anger. I would be annoyed if I discovered I was sold a lie.


Is that like when we voted to leave and now remainers are doing their best to stop it? Yeah, democracy is a bitch.

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#627203 - 07/09/19 08:09 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


How do you know what people voted for? I know plenty of leavers whoíd be happy with a no deal so they obviously knew. I know a few who want a deal. I know a lot of remain voters, myself included, who are utterly disillusioned and angry at this cropnof clowns for not getting us out.

Itís easy for remoaners to say people didnít know what they were voting for because itís easier for them to justify trying to over turn a democratic vote in the name of democracy. Like youíve said, democracy is a bitch when it donít go your way.

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#627204 - 07/09/19 08:17 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
EMP Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 05/04/12
Posts: 9149
Loc: Eire
Sorry the northern irish issue is just too complicated and sensitive to just let english democracy destroy it. Proper proposals are essential and obviously needed fast.

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#627205 - 07/09/19 08:54 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth


Democracy is a real bitch when it doesn't go your way.

Also I understand your anger. I would be annoyed if I discovered I was sold a lie.


Is that like when we voted to leave and now remainers are doing their best to stop it? Yeah, democracy is a bitch.


Many of those tories who voted against Bojo this week voted for May's deal. Bojo voted against May's Withdrawal deal twice. He then voted for her deal. That's the same deal he now wants to renegotiate. Clear as mud.

So who was trying to block the UK leaving the EU on those occasions when Bojo and the others were voting against May's deal? Who was doing their best to stop the UK leaving the EU then. The hypocrisy is breathtaking

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#627206 - 07/09/19 09:01 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


How do you know what people voted for? I know plenty of leavers whoíd be happy with a no deal so they obviously knew. I know a few who want a deal. I know a lot of remain voters, myself included, who are utterly disillusioned and angry at this cropnof clowns for not getting us out.

Itís easy for remoaners to say people didnít know what they were voting for because itís easier for them to justify trying to over turn a democratic vote in the name of democracy. Like youíve said, democracy is a bitch when it donít go your way.


Apparently you seem to know what people voted for. After all you did say "Knowingly or not, people voted to leave without a deal".

People,who voted leave were assured by Gove and Bojo among others that there would be a deal. (see quotes elsewhere)

By the way it was you who first suggested that people didn't know what they were voting for. (See your quote above)

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#627207 - 07/09/19 09:02 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
I see Rudd has found her conscience.

Better late than ever I suppose.

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#627208 - 08/09/19 04:01 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Cabinet minister resigns, I think at this pace it would be easier to call the Tory party the Brexit party...But wait a minute, that brand is already taken by Farage. The new episodes is getting better, I think getting the PM jailed for not obeying the law will be the next high point.


Edited by EnergisedReds (08/09/19 04:02 AM)

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#627209 - 08/09/19 09:23 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I think people are missing the point of the orginal post. I can understand fully why shaggy can't understand and it's not fair to ask him to.

However for the rest this is not about the pros and cons of brexit this is about the changes the establishment has done to stop brexit as described in OP.

These are changes to our Democratic processes that no one voted for and have largely been carried out by stealth


Democracy is a real bitch when it doesn't go your way.

Also I understand your anger. I would be annoyed if I discovered I was sold a lie.


Is that like when we voted to leave and now remainers are doing their best to stop it? Yeah, democracy is a bitch.


Many of those tories who voted against Bojo this week voted for May's deal. Bojo voted against May's Withdrawal deal twice. He then voted for her deal. That's the same deal he now wants to renegotiate. Clear as mud.

So who was trying to block the UK leaving the EU on those occasions when Bojo and the others were voting against May's deal? Who was doing their best to stop the UK leaving the EU then. The hypocrisy is breathtaking


As I e said before. I hold ALL of them with the highest contempt. That includes BoJo.

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#627210 - 08/09/19 09:27 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
So are you saying it's OK to implement something that people didn't know they were voting for?

Again, the problem is that your PM is a liar who can't be trusted by the opposition.

You do know that that tories are talking about entering into an electoral pact with Farage.

Also they only formed the current government after entering into a confidence and supply agreement with the DUP


How do you know what people voted for? I know plenty of leavers whoíd be happy with a no deal so they obviously knew. I know a few who want a deal. I know a lot of remain voters, myself included, who are utterly disillusioned and angry at this cropnof clowns for not getting us out.

Itís easy for remoaners to say people didnít know what they were voting for because itís easier for them to justify trying to over turn a democratic vote in the name of democracy. Like youíve said, democracy is a bitch when it donít go your way.


Apparently you seem to know what people voted for. After all you did say "Knowingly or not, people voted to leave without a deal".

People,who voted leave were assured by Gove and Bojo among others that there would be a deal. (see quotes elsewhere)

By the way it was you who first suggested that people didn't know what they were voting for. (See your quote above)


I get an idea from travelling and meeting people in my country. Mainly through work or other work colleagues who all knew what they were voting for. Some want a deal some don't. Some wanted to remain. But ALL to a man and woman want it sorted in whatever way possible. Even a no deal is better than this nonsense.

And yes we know leave campaign lied. Thatís nothing new and no real shocker from politicians. Your man Steptoe also lies as he said heíd respect the result. I suppose heíll do that only when he thinks he can win an election? And there wouldíve been a deal by now if they ALL had stopped playing politics with this.

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#627211 - 08/09/19 11:20 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation. You were deputed here by the people to get grievances addressed but are yourselves become the greatest grievance

Oliver Cromwell 1653

The dates may change but the situation doesn't 400 years on. In thÚse days parlŪament was a drunken mess consisting of Lords who looked after their own personal interests and regarded the ordinary people as sub human. Not really massively different today is it ?
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627212 - 08/09/19 11:56 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation. You were deputed here by the people to get grievances addressed but are yourselves become the greatest grievance

Oliver Cromwell 1653

The dates may change but the situation doesn't 400 years on. In thÚse days parlŪament was a drunken mess consisting of Lords who looked after their own personal interests and regarded the ordinary people as sub human. Not really massively different today is it ?


Can you please explain to me what personal interest are the likes of Ken Clarke, Philip Hammond, Amber Rudd etc looking after. If anything, I think your PM is doing everything he can to recoup the voters of the Brexit party after what happened in the European elections and not even thinking about how bad a no deal could be to your country, even a big Brexiter like you always belived a deal, am I wrong.


Edited by EnergisedReds (08/09/19 11:56 AM)

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#627217 - 08/09/19 04:02 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation. You were deputed here by the people to get grievances addressed but are yourselves become the greatest grievance

Oliver Cromwell 1653

The dates may change but the situation doesn't 400 years on. In thÚse days parlŪament was a drunken mess consisting of Lords who looked after their own personal interests and regarded the ordinary people as sub human. Not really massively different today is it ?


Let me guess, you want parliament closed down and Bojo declared the Lord Protector.

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#627223 - 09/09/19 06:04 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation. You were deputed here by the people to get grievances addressed but are yourselves become the greatest grievance

Oliver Cromwell 1653

The dates may change but the situation doesn't 400 years on. In thÚse days parlŪament was a drunken mess consisting of Lords who looked after their own personal interests and regarded the ordinary people as sub human. Not really massively different today is it ?


Let me guess, you want parliament closed down and Bojo declared the Lord Protector.


I want the democratic decision of the British people implemented as we were promised both before and after the vote. I don't think that's a big ask


Edited by Stanley Park (09/09/19 06:05 PM)
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#627224 - 09/09/19 06:13 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
lumba Offline
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Registered: 19/03/09
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Necessity has no law.
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#627226 - 09/09/19 07:37 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation. You were deputed here by the people to get grievances addressed but are yourselves become the greatest grievance

Oliver Cromwell 1653

The dates may change but the situation doesn't 400 years on. In thÚse days parlŪament was a drunken mess consisting of Lords who looked after their own personal interests and regarded the ordinary people as sub human. Not really massively different today is it ?


Let me guess, you want parliament closed down and Bojo declared the Lord Protector.


I want the democratic decision of the British people implemented as we were promised both before and after the vote. I don't think that's a big ask


You may yet get your wish Stan. After today I think Bojo might opt for a N. Ireland only backstop. He is no longer beholding to the DUP.



Edited by Shaggydog (09/09/19 07:37 PM)

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#627227 - 09/09/19 08:43 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
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Not followed the Northern Ireland developments last day or so but that has always been a political thing to stop or frustrate brexit. Now the time is coming to having to find a solution miraculously a solution is found. I am hearing the Benn bill to stop brexit has loopholes galore not surprising as it was rushed through in four days. For example Johnson could comply with the law present the letter to the EU and when asked why the extension is needed simply say he doesn't know ! Making it very difficult for the EU to grant without looking ridiculous. There are other options too I have heard and no doubt some we don't know yet

However is this all not getting silly now ? What is going on ?
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#627228 - 09/09/19 09:15 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
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Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Not followed the Northern Ireland developments last day or so but that has always been a political thing to stop or frustrate brexit. Now the time is coming to having to find a solution miraculously a solution is found. I am hearing the Benn bill to stop brexit has loopholes galore not surprising as it was rushed through in four days. For example Johnson could comply with the law present the letter to the EU and when asked why the extension is needed simply say he doesn't know ! Making it very difficult for the EU to grant without looking ridiculous. There are other options too I have heard and no doubt some we don't know yet

However is this all not getting silly now ? What is going on ?


Yeah the whole N. Ireland thing is just a bit of craic because we all want a hard border and direct rule just like before.

Your parliament has become a laughing stock.

BoJo's only way out now is to repackage May's deal and claim he has won concessions.

A N Ireland only backstop would be acceptable to the majority in N. Irelamd. If Bojo agrees a deal he will win the election as he will be able to claim that he has delivered Brexit. If he secures a big enough majority he will no longer need the DUP. However Fargage is still demanding a No deal Brexit and is already suggesting that Bojo is back tracking.

The ERG probably want a No Deal and reparations.

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#627229 - 09/09/19 10:19 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
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The British parliament is a laughing stock I agree with that. As I said on previous occasions I would have voted for Theresa Mays deal but parliament decided otherwise

As for the Northern Ireland border who would instal and police it ? Not the British then who the Republic of Ireland the EU ? A hard border was never on the cards it's a ploy to improve the EU,s negotiating position assisted by ROI who I expect are getting a little nervous now no deal looks very real
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#627230 - 10/09/19 12:07 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EMP Offline
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Registered: 05/04/12
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looks to me boris just made sure no deal cannot happen..maybe that was his plan all along..poor me vote for me. Tho i think he will be ousted way before an election, his whatsapp messages contain a "scandal" and have been legally requested.


Edited by EMP (10/09/19 12:07 AM)

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#627231 - 10/09/19 02:35 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
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Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The British parliament is a laughing stock I agree with that. As I said on previous occasions I would have voted for Theresa Mays deal but parliament decided otherwise

As for the Northern Ireland border who would instal and police it ? Not the British then who the Republic of Ireland the EU ? A hard border was never on the cards it's a ploy to improve the EU,s negotiating position assisted by ROI who I expect are getting a little nervous now no deal looks very real


As far as I understand the EU never wanted a a hard border in NI, but then the border would have been de facto in the sea which the DUP refused, remember, when they threatened May. So how can it be a ploy to improve the EU position if it is the DUP that forced your government to refuse that option? What are you talking about.

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#627233 - 10/09/19 08:44 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EnergisedReds]
EMP Offline
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Registered: 05/04/12
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The backstop was a british proposal in the first place lol.

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#627237 - 10/09/19 11:38 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EMP]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
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Loc: Not the EU
Originally Posted By EMP
The backstop was a british proposal in the first place lol.


Time this utter nonsense was brought to an end. This cannot go on the british people voted to leave the EU well over three years ago
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#627240 - 10/09/19 01:12 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Originally Posted By EMP
The backstop was a british proposal in the first place lol.


Time this utter nonsense was brought to an end. This cannot go on the british people voted to leave the EU well over three years ago



You are absolutely correct

A minority government, led by an PM who has lost 6 of the 6 votes he has faced in parliament continues to try to force a No Deal brexit on the country. The same PM has prorogued parliament and has threatened to defy the law in order to ignore the will of the same parliament.

Utter nonsense indeed.


Edited by Shaggydog (10/09/19 01:15 PM)

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#627241 - 10/09/19 07:04 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
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Loc: Not the EU
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election
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#627245 - 10/09/19 09:21 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election


And you left out the truth.

Remain MP's have simply refused to let Bojo dictate the electoral agenda. They are able to do this because your PM is now a lame duck with no electoral mandate, no brexit plan and no majority.

Unfortunately your PM is also a proven liar and can't be trusted to keep his word. Hence the delay.

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#627246 - 10/09/19 09:31 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
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Originally Posted By Stanley Park
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election


Thatís ok though to those who refuse to accept the result of the vote.

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#627247 - 10/09/19 09:40 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election


Thatís ok though to those who refuse to accept the result of the vote.


That's what happens when you have a lame duck PM who can't be trusted to keep his word.

But don't take my word for it. Ask his brother.

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#627248 - 10/09/19 10:38 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
EMP Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 05/04/12
Posts: 9149
Loc: Eire
he denied his own daughter..pure scum

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#627249 - 11/09/19 02:23 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
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Originally Posted By Stanley Park
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election


I hear everybody asking for an election but after the 31st Oct, not sure how moving it by 2-3 weeks is a refusal.

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#627251 - 11/09/19 06:38 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
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Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
You left out Remain MP,s refusing to allow an election


Thatís ok though to those who refuse to accept the result of the vote.


That's what happens when you have a lame duck PM who can't be trusted to keep his word.

But don't take my word for it. Ask his brother.





Iíll ask people in this country thanks (I know his brother is) and almost all of them want this sorted and think all our politicians are behaving like children and in their own interests.

People are past caring about personalities and partyís. They just want the result carried out so we can all move in with our lives. Whatever you think of BoJo (not much for me) at least he wants to actually crack on and get this sorted.

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#627252 - 11/09/19 06:51 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
EMP Offline
1st Team Squad

Registered: 05/04/12
Posts: 9149
Loc: Eire
crack on my arse..he wants to get elected... which is why he is closing down public debate and revelations .. he knows too bloody well a no deal is a disaster. U actually fall for his bullcrap after he shuts down the govt?????????????????

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#627253 - 11/09/19 09:13 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EMP]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
We have a far left agitator from the Republic of Ireland and a sectarian republican with a questionable background telling the British people what they think. Hope you don't mind but I prefer to listen to the British people. As wilki says the vast majority however they voted in the referendum simply want the government to get on with it. Johnson whether you like him or not is simply trying to implement what the British people voted for. The reason the remain MP,s wont allow a vote is they fear he will win an election and implement what the majority of British people (including many remainers want). Another reason they want to push the election past October (although they won't admit it) is it will boost the brexit party which will negate the Tory leave vote.
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#627255 - 11/09/19 10:02 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EMP]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By EMP
crack on my arse..he wants to get elected... which is why he is closing down public debate and revelations .. he knows too bloody well a no deal is a disaster. U actually fall for his bullcrap after he shuts down the govt?????????????????


And the rest donít want to get elected? What a stupid comment. The fact they donít want the election right now tells me theyíre not confident they would.

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#627256 - 11/09/19 10:05 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
We have a far left agitator from the Republic of Ireland and a sectarian republican with a questionable background telling the British people what they think. Hope you don't mind but I prefer to listen to the British people. As wilki says the vast majority however they voted in the referendum simply want the government to get on with it. Johnson whether you like him or not is simply trying to implement what the British people voted for. The reason the remain MP,s wont allow a vote is they fear he will win an election and implement what the majority of British people (including many remainers want). Another reason they want to push the election past October (although they won't admit it) is it will boost the brexit party which will negate the Tory leave vote.


They claim to be worried heíll move the election date but surely they can set that date in stone? They seem to be able to pass whatever other laws they please so why not that? The others all know they wouldnít win right now so despite calling for an election for the past two years are running away from it. Pathetic idiots the lot of them.

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#627261 - 11/09/19 02:40 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
We have a far left agitator from the Republic of Ireland and a sectarian republican with a questionable background telling the British people what they think. Hope you don't mind but I prefer to listen to the British people. As wilki says the vast majority however they voted in the referendum simply want the government to get on with it. Johnson whether you like him or not is simply trying to implement what the British people voted for. The reason the remain MP,s wont allow a vote is they fear he will win an election and implement what the majority of British people (including many remainers want). Another reason they want to push the election past October (although they won't admit it) is it will boost the brexit party which will negate the Tory leave vote.


A right wing racist who is also openly anti Irish attacks Irish people. Who would have thought it. The same racist is actively promoting a No Deal Brexit. That's all very easy when you have a triple lock pension and your family raised isn't it.

Your solution to the back stop was a trusted trader scheme. When it was explained to you (again) that the EU had already rejected that your new solution was to decide that it was none of Ireland's business what britain decided to do. That's the best you have.

Even the dogs in the street know why the election is being postponed until after October 31st. But you chose to ignore that and resort to name calling as usual.

Your current lame duck PM has lost all 6 votes he has faced since he was appointed. He is a proven liar, leading a minority government with no brexit plan who has now been found guilty of proroguing your parliament illegally.

And you try to lecture others. Laughed at!

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#627262 - 11/09/19 02:42 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
[quote=Stanley Park]We have a far left agitator from the Republic of Ireland and a sectarian republican with a questionable background telling the British people what they think. Hope you don't mind but I prefer to listen to the British people. As wilki says the vast majority however they voted in the referendum simply want the government to get on with it. Johnson whether you like him or not is simply trying to implement what the British people voted for. The reason the remain MP,s wont allow a vote is they fear he will win an election and implement what the majority of British people (including many remainers want). Another reason they want to push the election past October (although they won't admit it) is it will boost the brexit party which will negate the Tory leave vote.


They claim to be worried heíll move the election date but surely they can set that date in stone? They seem to be able to pass whatever other laws they please so why not that? The others all know they wouldnít win right now so despite calling for an election for the past two years are running away from it. Pathetic idiots the lot of them.

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/prime-ministers-powers-over-election-date

Here's your problem. Unfortunately Bojo can't be trusted.

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#627265 - 11/09/19 04:09 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
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Like I said, they can pass laws to stop a no deal so I donít believe they couldnít do the same for an election date.

Theyíre scared. Simple as. Itís all Steptoe has been in about for 2 whole years! Now itís not the right time?? Says it all.

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#627266 - 11/09/19 04:22 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Like I said, they can pass laws to stop a no deal so I donít believe they couldnít do the same for an election date.

Theyíre scared. Simple as. Itís all Steptoe has been in about for 2 whole years! Now itís not the right time?? Says it all.


Well whether you believe it or not is your right.

Either way you will only have to wait an extra few weeks for your election.

No one will have an excuse then. But a No Deal Brexit will have been avoided

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#627267 - 11/09/19 04:29 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
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I see I have upset our Irish freedom fighter that normally indicates you are doing something right.

What is a no deal brexit ?
_________________________
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#627268 - 11/09/19 04:39 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
I see I have upset our Irish freedom fighter that normally indicates you are doing something right.

What is a no deal brexit ?


Oh dear.

Another fine day for Boris Johnson as he becomes the first prime minister to have been found by a court to have misled a king or queen.

In effect, the court has held that Boris Johnson lied to the Queen so as to obtain prorogation

Democracy, tory style.




Edited by Shaggydog (11/09/19 04:40 PM)

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#627272 - 11/09/19 04:53 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
lumba Offline
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Registered: 19/03/09
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Loc: Destination unknown
Surely that warrants a beheading.
_________________________
That job interview was going so well until I realized I was fukked up on acid in the middle of a cornfield naked and talking to a scarecrow.

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#627273 - 11/09/19 04:54 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: lumba]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Originally Posted By lumba
Surely that warrants a beheading.


Well there would be no brain damage inflicted.

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#627275 - 11/09/19 04:55 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: lumba]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Shaggy picking up the current days headlines again. Something to tell you shaggy pretty much everyone on this forum has the internet and a television set. Fancy that eh ?
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#627276 - 11/09/19 05:04 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
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Registered: 30/12/10
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Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Shaggy picking up the current days headlines again. Something to tell you shaggy pretty much everyone on this forum has the internet and a television set. Fancy that eh ?


No answers anymore Stan?

It's not surprising, even you can no longer defend Bojo.

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#627277 - 11/09/19 05:16 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
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Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Shaggy picking up the current days headlines again. Something to tell you shaggy pretty much everyone on this forum has the internet and a television set. Fancy that eh ?


Bojo on facebook earlier

Staying in the EU could cost £250 million per week

Bojo during the referendum

We send the EU £350 million per week.

Another Boris lie or yet more tory cuts.

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#627278 - 11/09/19 05:33 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
Re the court case it gets madder by the minute. I can't pretend to understand it but the English court last week ruled it legal the Scottish court today said it was illegal.

The Scottish judgement seems to centre around johnsons motivation. How can a court rule on that ? Isn't there something in law that states the law cannot look into people's souls ?

My guess is the Scottish verdict will be overturned on appeal. But really this is becoming a complete farce.

Re shaggys post above that does not warrant a sensible reply
_________________________
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#627279 - 11/09/19 05:36 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Re the court case it gets madder by the minute. I can't pretend to understand it but the English court last week ruled it legal the Scottish court today said it was illegal.

The Scottish judgement seems to centre around johnsons motivation. How can a court rule on that ? Isn't there something in law that states the law cannot look into people's souls ?

My guess is the Scottish verdict will be overturned on appeal. But really this is becoming a complete farce.

Re shaggys post above that does not warrant a sensible reply


If only you would give us even one sensible reply. Even one would be a start.

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#627280 - 11/09/19 06:43 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
Re the court case it gets madder by the minute. I can't pretend to understand it but the English court last week ruled it legal the Scottish court today said it was illegal.

The Scottish judgement seems to centre around johnsons motivation. How can a court rule on that ? Isn't there something in law that states the law cannot look into people's souls ?

My guess is the Scottish verdict will be overturned on appeal. But really this is becoming a complete farce.

Re shaggys post above that does not warrant a sensible reply


I don't know but were the evidence presented the same? In any case lawyers always say that laws are not clear cut but open for interpretation, thus the existence of courts. But the appeal goes to the same supreme court, isn't it?

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#627287 - 11/09/19 07:33 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: EnergisedReds]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry

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#627288 - 11/09/19 07:35 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Like I said, they can pass laws to stop a no deal so I donít believe they couldnít do the same for an election date.

Theyíre scared. Simple as. Itís all Steptoe has been in about for 2 whole years! Now itís not the right time?? Says it all.


Well whether you believe it or not is your right.

Either way you will only have to wait an extra few weeks for your election.

No one will have an excuse then. But a No Deal Brexit will have been avoided


Itís clear that Steptoe fancied his chances against May but I think BoJo would win and they know it. Looking after themselves, frustrating as long as they can until they think they can take advantage. For the good of the country I suppose?

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#627289 - 11/09/19 07:43 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Shaggydog Offline
1st Team Regular

Registered: 30/12/10
Posts: 11009
Loc: Derry
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Originally Posted By Shaggydog
Originally Posted By wilkij1975
Like I said, they can pass laws to stop a no deal so I donít believe they couldnít do the same for an election date.

Theyíre scared. Simple as. Itís all Steptoe has been in about for 2 whole years! Now itís not the right time?? Says it all.


Well whether you believe it or not is your right.

Either way you will only have to wait an extra few weeks for your election.

No one will have an excuse then. But a No Deal Brexit will have been avoided


Itís clear that Steptoe fancied his chances against May but I think BoJo would win and they know it. Looking after themselves, frustrating as long as they can until they think they can take advantage. For the good of the country I suppose?


Well you will find out soon.

Have you had a look at operation yellowhammer.

Project fear looks like project harsh reality.

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#627297 - 11/09/19 08:07 PM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Shaggydog]
wilkij1975 Online   content
Liverpool Legend

Registered: 26/06/09
Posts: 21897
Loc: Northamptonshire
No I havenít. I voted to remain so Iím sure thereís nothing in there thatís shock me. Plus I donít want a no deal Brexit.

But what I also donít want is this bunch of pure and total utter C bombs ruining my country by frustrating this process for their own gains. Each and everyone of them are in this for themselves whether itís BoJo or comrade Corbyn. If they put their parties at the door along with any hand ups about each otherís personalities, we may actually manage to get out and stop the damage that this farce is going to cause.

This isnít just my view either. Almost everyone Iíve spoken to about this whether itís s friend or work colleague or customer all say the same thing. Doesnít matter who they vote for or whether they voted remain or leave. They all are saying the same.

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#627308 - 12/09/19 09:55 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: wilkij1975]
Stanley Park Offline
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Registered: 21/10/09
Posts: 26435
Loc: Not the EU
The telegraph is printing Johnson is close to forming a new deal with the EU including agreement on the Irish border. No idea whether true but let's see. If true it's going to be interesting what parliament do and whether again they reject it.
_________________________
IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD SPEAK SOFTLY - BOB PAISLEY

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#627315 - 12/09/19 11:59 AM Re: British democracy dead and buried [Re: Stanley Park]
EnergisedReds Offline
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Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 20685
Originally Posted By Stanley Park
The telegraph is printing Johnson is close to forming a new deal with the EU including agreement on the Irish border. No idea whether true but let's see. If true it's going to be interesting what parliament do and whether again they reject it.


I suppose it will depend on the deal, if it is only for Boris to win the elections at the expense of the UK, then for your country, wouldn't it be better for them to reject?

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