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hopefully thats what tonight was.

ive always felt our midfield lacked heroes and it showed again tonight. Lallana should be gone already. Keita is disasterous although had a huge shout for a peno.

Rolling Danny out when we're out of ideas is not a plan either.

(what has happened to mo?)

Hopefully this is a wake up call to klopp.

In better news mane stepped up, hendo was delivering some great ball and did ok out of position. Fab was good when he came on.

We got a point, it could have been better, could have been worse.


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Yeah, we got what we deserved from that one. Keita was just ok, I expected more from him by now. We improved a tiny bit with Fab on the field. I'll be happier when we have our full defense back.

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Agree with most of that, don't think keita is a lost cause by any stretch but we do have a lot of very good but not top level midfielders (fabinho could prove that wrong yet)

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I am starting to get concerned it's all very well grinding out wins when you play badly but it's been a while since we played well. The only positive is City seem inflicted by the same thing


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That's my worry as well, we really haven't played all that great since before Christmas. However I'm not all that sure we've played all that well all season, at least in comparison to our breathtaking games last season. And yet look where we are. Is it just that this is the new liverpool under klopp? And if so I guess it's working. Although I'd rather we played like we did last season if it means finishing second or third regardless. Time will tell I guess

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In some ways a draw might keep us grounded. 7 point spread would suggest we're good enough and we're not. We need to step it up again.


Luis Garcia, He drinks sangria
He came from Barca, to bring us Joy
He's five foot seven, he's football heaven
please don't take my Luis away.

"...AND 32 MILLION POUNDS WORTH OF GOALKEEPER CAN'T DO A THING ABOUT IT"
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That's actually quite a good way of looking at tonight because we haven't been good enough but we definitely are good enough

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We need to mix it up a bit more, we've been Sussed by the opposition, and they're reading our every move, Harry Kane was like a map reader all night. So much for the hot weather training camp, we need those like we need a hole in the head. What we need is a new tactical camp.

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Been saying for a while that we need to mix things up, esp in our attacking methods. Having said that, whilst our defence was so tight, it didn't matter because we didn't need so many goals to win.

However, with our defence creaking now we need more attacking threat but it doesn't seem to be there. I don't think we can change too much now... so will have to rely on the defence becoming solid again.

By the way, what is wrong with Allison? He just doesn't seem to have learnt after that mistake very early in the season.


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Originally Posted By Hercules/AF 58
We need to mix it up a bit more, we've been Sussed by the opposition, and they're reading our every move, Harry Kane was like a map reader all night. So much for the hot weather training camp, we need those like we need a hole in the head. What we need is a new tactical camp.


Maguire... scoring did make him look like Kane. laugh

Hopefully it kicks us back to life and form. Long road ahead still

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Its disappointing at home we can't win with such form. We weren't at our best and the slow build up pisces me off when we need quickness to bypass the 2 walls they put in front of goal, no risks taken. Bitterly disappointed as we failed to capatilise on Rafa's gift.


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For me, the biggest disappointment was that the 2 forward players from the bench, not only couldn't improve the tem but were useless.

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I was working so missed the game however I watched a re-run.
What struck me was how different the team starting line up and positional set up was and must have been a huge boost to Leicester even before a ball was kicked. Klopp thought he could mash players into alien positions and immediately took Leicester for granted...this was a team who'd not long ago beat City & Chelsea within a matter of days over the Christmas period.

Probably VVD's worst game for us and the reason for that is because he was/is still ill. VVD managed 1 sketchy training session on the lead up to this game since they got back from Dubai. He was at fault for Leicester's equalizer in not picking up Maguire.

I was right about RB position in that Klopp had a surprise in store , Henderson who did ok there, although he should have been in midfield alongside Fabinho from the start. Keita has not done much previous to this game and should not have started..yes he had a pen call but Keita has not been the player we expected him to be.

Bringing Lallana on and then Sturridge on really shows that we are missing dynamic players from the bench. Lallana is on the wane, once upon a time he was able to influence games but now he is very short on ideas and is very lightweight, probably a victim of his injuries and not much playing time. Sturridge scored 1 worldy v Chelsea earlier in the season, but he is a square peg for a round hole in this team because he is anti-Klopp play philosophy...he doesn't run and chase players or the ball down, he wants it played to his feet all the time.

Hopefully this game was just a blip and Klopp never uses the excuse of the snow ever again...that's a Brendanism right there!

The upside we are 1 point further clear of City.

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We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.

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Originally Posted By redordead13
We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.


It will depend on the fitness of our 3 forwards, we miss even one we are fked as Lallana and Sturridge cannot be relied upon. Even Shaq is not the same as a couple of months back

Last edited by TiredReds; 31/01/19 03:39 PM.
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Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.


It will depend on the fitness of our 3 forwards, we miss even one we are fked as Lallana and Sturridge cannot be relied upon. Even Shaq is not the same as a couple of months back


Well, fortunately they have pretty excellent fitness records. Mane has gotten injured before, but Mo and Firmino are never injured. Shaquiri had one bad game.

City are similarly screwed if Aguero gets hurt again (as they have showed this season) and he is more injury prone than any of our 3. Silva and De Bruyne also have had fitness issues.

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Both us n City looked nervous, it's not the end of the world, we'd a lost that one a few seasons ago and Leicester are no muppets on their day. Salah was a bit out of sorts as was Shaq, Keita isn't up to speed yet and I don't think we'll see the real player until next season. The obvious miss is TTA and Gomez. Hope to see a reaction against West Ham and City have a tough game. Still a long way t go.

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Originally Posted By elimmel
Originally Posted By Hercules/AF 58
We need to mix it up a bit more, we've been Sussed by the opposition, and they're reading our every move, Harry Kane was like a map reader all night. So much for the hot weather training camp, we need those like we need a hole in the head. What we need is a new tactical camp.


Maguire... scoring did make him look like Kane. laugh

Hopefully it kicks us back to life and form. Long road ahead still

Yeah I noticed that bloomer after I'd posted it elimmel, but too [oops] off to be bothered, really disappointed by the performance last night. And as someone else indicated the substitutions were pathetic. Actually we were lucky to escape with a draw in the end, given we were robbed of a clear penalty.

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Originally Posted By Hercules/AF 58
We need to mix it up a bit more, we've been Sussed by the opposition, and they're reading our every move, Harry Kane was like a map reader all night. So much for the hot weather training camp, we need those like we need a hole in the head. What we need is a new tactical camp.


I know you like a good conspiracy theory Herc grin just like me...
What "IF" VVD & Fab where nobbled by the Sheikh's on our trip in Dubai?

Let's face it, whenever they get their noses put out of place, they do like their revenge....Jamal Khashoggi anyone?

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Originally Posted By redordead13
Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.


It will depend on the fitness of our 3 forwards, we miss even one we are fked as Lallana and Sturridge cannot be relied upon. Even Shaq is not the same as a couple of months back


Well, fortunately they have pretty excellent fitness records. Mane has gotten injured before, but Mo and Firmino are never injured. Shaquiri had one bad game.

City are similarly screwed if Aguero gets hurt again (as they have showed this season) and he is more injury prone than any of our 3. Silva and De Bruyne also have had fitness issues.


Well you’ve just jinxed that grin

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Originally Posted By redordead13
Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.


It will depend on the fitness of our 3 forwards, we miss even one we are fked as Lallana and Sturridge cannot be relied upon. Even Shaq is not the same as a couple of months back


Well, fortunately they have pretty excellent fitness records. Mane has gotten injured before, but Mo and Firmino are never injured. Shaquiri had one bad game.

City are similarly screwed if Aguero gets hurt again (as they have showed this season) and he is more injury prone than any of our 3. Silva and De Bruyne also have had fitness issues.


No, Aguero has missed quite a few games and they still won comfortably, they have also missed the Silvas and De Bruyne. Their biggest miss has actually been Fernandinho, especially when De Bruyne was missing at the same time. Jesus is much better that Sturridge and Origi.

Last edited by TiredReds; 31/01/19 06:19 PM.
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Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By redordead13
We are a point further ahead than we were last week. And if form holds, City will drop more points than us between now and the end, and they have a tougher schedule. They also dropped points at Leicester (they actually lost that game) along with Palace and Newcastle.

We took 4 out of 6 from the Foxes today, and City can take a MAXIMUM of 3. It's a point gained, and we don't have to play Leicester again.

The only tough away fixtures we have left are United and Everton. City effective need to win every game AND have a 5 point swing in 14 games, which would be quite an ask, because our lead has grown, not shrunk. Even if they win everything else, we can still afford a loss and a draw.

7 points would be better, but we have Trent and Gomez coming back from injury soon, Milner back from suspension, and VVD will improve as he gets healthy. No reason to panic.


It will depend on the fitness of our 3 forwards, we miss even one we are fked as Lallana and Sturridge cannot be relied upon. Even Shaq is not the same as a couple of months back


Well, fortunately they have pretty excellent fitness records. Mane has gotten injured before, but Mo and Firmino are never injured. Shaquiri had one bad game.

City are similarly screwed if Aguero gets hurt again (as they have showed this season) and he is more injury prone than any of our 3. Silva and De Bruyne also have had fitness issues.


No, Aguero has missed quite a few games and they still won comfortably, they have also missed the Silvas and De Bruyne. Their biggest miss has actually been Fernandinho, especially when De Bruyne was missing at the same time. Jesus is much better that Sturridge and Origi.


Jesus had quite a long goal drought, and they lost to Leicester and Palace in December while Aguero was hurt.

They have missed all of those players and it has hurt them. They are not having as good of a season as they did last year, when they absolutely destroyed the league. They've two more losses and several more draws than they did this time last year.

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It's all about squad depth,and we are very thin in defense. Second string defenders way below first teamers. Let's hope Trent and Joe are back soon, and VVD and Robbo stay away from injuries.

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Originally Posted By redordead13


Jesus had quite a long goal drought, and they lost to Leicester and Palace in December while Aguero was hurt.

They have missed all of those players and it has hurt them. They are not having as good of a season as they did last year, when they absolutely destroyed the league. They've two more losses and several more draws than they did this time last year.


For sure they were much better last season, else we wouldn't be first. Any other team missing Aguero, de Bruyne, David Silva, Mendy, Company for long periods wouldn't be in that position, they still coped. We had Gomez out and suddenly we started to concede more, if we lose 1 or 2 of our forwards, we will have Lallana and Sturridge starting.

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Please keep Lallana out of the first 18 any given day really. Rather have a youngster that could one day turn good playing instead of a burnt out, scared of getting injured, player.

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Originally Posted By Pickles
Originally Posted By Hercules/AF 58
We need to mix it up a bit more, we've been Sussed by the opposition, and they're reading our every move, Harry Kane was like a map reader all night. So much for the hot weather training camp, we need those like we need a hole in the head. What we need is a new tactical camp.


I know you like a good conspiracy theory Herc grin just like me...
What "IF" VVD & Fab where nobbled by the Sheikh's on our trip in Dubai?

Let's face it, whenever they get their noses put out of place, they do like their revenge....Jamal Khashoggi anyone?
funny you should say that Pickles, I've been haunted by that thought ever since I heard they were going out there, "Come into my parlour said the spider to the fly". And then they all come back suffering from some mysterious virus or bug! It's way too much of a coincidence for my liking...and yes I do recall the fate of Khashoggi, these guys don't like to lose....?

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Oh merciful hour, and upon me soul,
Such a massive kick up in the hole,
Is more than a mortal fan can thole,
And who'd deny:
Some Mullah spike'd our sausage roll,
Out in Dubai?

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Injuries aside, I am concerned about how slow our play is and how complacent the side appears to have become.There is no urgency and hunger at the moment.

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The midweek game was a culmination of problems in my view:

Conditions were awful.
Leicester played well, to a good plan.
We had a few key injuries and players that were not 100% and forced into the game.
We had an extended break, we never play well after breaks like that and seem to lose our rhythm.

Maybe the midweek poor performance came at a good time, City lost so we extended our lead anyways, Klopp can use this as a wake up call for the players, if they want to win the PL they are going to have to step up and give it their all, more performances like Wednesday and we can forget it.

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Originally Posted By ecnirp98
The midweek game was a culmination of problems in my view:

Conditions were awful.
Leicester played well, to a good plan.
We had a few key injuries and players that were not 100% and forced into the game.
We had an extended break, we never play well after breaks like that and seem to lose our rhythm.

Maybe the midweek poor performance came at a good time, City lost so we extended our lead anyways, Klopp can use this as a wake up call for the players, if they want to win the PL they are going to have to step up and give it their all, more performances like Wednesday and we can forget it.


Yep, we played home, scored early dominating the first half hour, then nothing. Salah and Firmino were inexistant and Shaq has been poor lately. It can happen but losing 2 pts at home is not good.

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Our build up is too slow and by the time our front three receive the ball they are surrounded and have no space at all. We need to up the tempo and as Souey says, start producing combinations in the middle of the park.

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Originally Posted By chesterville
Our build up is too slow and by the time our front three receive the ball they are surrounded and have no space at all. We need to up the tempo and as Souey says, start producing combinations in the middle of the park.


Indeed, this is the big difference with last season, can't understand why it changed so much. Cannot be because we don't have Coutinho.

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Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By chesterville
Our build up is too slow and by the time our front three receive the ball they are surrounded and have no space at all. We need to up the tempo and as Souey says, start producing combinations in the middle of the park.


Indeed, this is the big difference with last season, can't understand why it changed so much. Cannot be because we don't have Coutinho.


Teams are wary of coming forward for fear of being caught on the break. Might have been a different story if two recent occasions when we broke forward had resulted in red cards for Kompany and Maguire. Fine margins again. I think another day you get the luck. We need to play with a bit more width and it always looks more pedestrian with Henderson in the team. A lot is down to team selection which Klopp has got right far more often than not this season.

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Originally Posted By SSO
Originally Posted By TiredReds
Originally Posted By chesterville
Our build up is too slow and by the time our front three receive the ball they are surrounded and have no space at all. We need to up the tempo and as Souey says, start producing combinations in the middle of the park.


Indeed, this is the big difference with last season, can't understand why it changed so much. Cannot be because we don't have Coutinho.


Teams are wary of coming forward for fear of being caught on the break. Might have been a different story if two recent occasions when we broke forward had resulted in red cards for Kompany and Maguire. Fine margins again. I think another day you get the luck. We need to play with a bit more width and it always looks more pedestrian with Henderson in the team. A lot is down to team selection which Klopp has got right far more often than not this season.


I think Klopp wanted us more secure defensively, so the MF are not all bombing forward at the same time to support the attacks/breaks, which is a big reason we have conceded so few goals, but this also impacts the attack.

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While I think tactics and selection had an impact, I'd suggest the performance had more to do with individual performance levels. Key members simply didn't show. Salah was invisible, and the odd time he manifested in the flesh he looked and acted like a member of the walking dead. Shaqueri and Firmino little better, even the great VvD was a shadow of his normal self. Even Alisson was making me nervous. On top of all that Klopp's substitutions were mind boggling in their banality!
I'd suggest that all future breaks away be held in Alaska or Siberia, or alternatively Outer Mongolia might suffice.

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